THE ECONOMICS SOCIETY

SHRI RAM COLLEGE OF COMMERCE

nexus
Where conversations converge.

What’s Inside?
Rachel Thomas, First Indian Woman Skydiver
Mitali Nikore, Pioneering Economist
K. S. Vijendra, Co-Founder and Chancellor, Shobhit University
Akshat Shrivastava, Entrepreneur and YouTuber

2024
Volume 1
Editor’s Note
"It is the province of knowledge to speak, and it is the privilege of wisdom to listen."
- Oliver Wendell Holmes Sr.

With immense pride and honour, we present the inaugural edition of Nexus: The
Live-Interview Magazine.

It is our earnest attempt to foster meaningful discourse by engaging with luminaries

from academia and offering fresh perspectives, through the lens of seasoned
professionals. Articulating these conversations into the written form has been
nothing short of a visionary pursuit; a true manifestation of our creative
imagination. We extend our heartfelt gratitude to all the esteemed interviewees who
graciously spared their valuable time to enrich this prestigious publication.

May our readers derive as much pleasure in perusing the magazine as we did in
conducting these insightful interviews. The broad spectrum of topics is designed to
resonate with our audience and ignite further discussion and contemplation around
the same.

We hold an optimistic outlook on the profound knowledge that readers will gain as
they navigate the meticulously architected and artistically designed pages of this
magazine.

In closing, our sincere appreciation goes to our interviewees and the entire team at
The Economics Society, SRCC for affording us the extraordinary opportunity to
engage directly and share space with individuals who have not only achieved
exceptional success but have also brought pride to our nation.

We profoundly hope that Nexus will ignite a flame of motivation, inspiring our
readers to pursue their own unique paths to what some may refer to as "success."

Arin Verma & Paridhi Gupta

 TABLE OF CONTENTS
Gender Equity and Perseverance

Live interview featuring Ms Rachel Thomas 1-8

Leveling the Playing Field: Gender Equity and

9-11
Sports

Shifting Tides of Technological Significance

Live interview featuring Ms Mitali Nikore 12-18

Harnessing Technology for Gender Equality

19-20
and Sustainable Development

Rethinking Educational Narratives

Live interview featuring Mr K.S.Vijendra 21-28

Beyond Colonial Paradigms: Charting a New

29-31
Course for Education in India

Decision-Making in Finance

Live interview featuring Mr Akshat Shrivastava 32-38

In the Balance: The Art and Science of

39-41
Financial Decision Making
ISSUE 1, VOL 1

GENDER EQUITY
AND
PERSEVERANCE

featuring
RACHEL THOMAS
India's First Female Skydiver
Padma Shri Awardee
2

In Conversation with Ms Rachel Thomas

Welcome to the inaugural episode of the Live Interview series. In this premiere edition, we are honoured to
host Ms Rachel Thomas, a trailblazer in the world of skydiving and a true inspiration for women breaking
barriers globally. As the pioneering female skydiver in India, Ms Thomas has not only etched her name in
the history of extreme sports but has also become a symbol of empowerment and fearlessness.
Recipient of the prestigious Padma Shri Award, Ms Thomas has spent over two decades defying gravity and
societal norms, leaving an indelible mark on the world of skydiving. Her journey serves as a beacon for
countless women, motivating them to pursue their passions unapologetically. Throughout her illustrious
career, she has not only set new standards of excellence but has also shattered stereotypes surrounding
gender roles in sports.

Paridhi: Being the first Indian woman to skydive, you have inspired many people around you. I'm
inquisitive to know what made you choose skydiving in particular.

Ms Rachel: As a kid, I always wanted to fly like a bird. And I was taken away. I was taken aback when I
used to see the eagles and the kites just hanging in there in the air. And they were just floating. They were
not even fluttering their wings or anything. And they were just soaring and enjoying themselves. At the
time, I was too young to understand the dynamics of science—that they would look for thermals, and
they would just play and be there in the thermals that would keep them there. So of course, much later,
when I got into aerosports and understood the dynamics and the science of aerosports, it was a different
thing. But for me, the sky always attracted me. I was born in Calcutta, in West Bengal. So there, it's a
very different scene. Like you're from Gujarat and it is a different scene: kite flying is a memorable part
of Gujarati culture. In Calcutta, there's more inclination towards art, music and literature and not much
preference for sports. However, at a later stage of my life, I did come across women who were my age and
were pilots. It was always a dream of mine to become a pilot, but due to our simple and humble
background, we were never aware that such opportunities existed for women to pursue an aviation
career.

Paridhi: So, like pursuing a child's dream, maybe.

Arin: Moving on to the next question. Having received the Padma Shri in 2005 from Dr. A.P.J. Abdul
Kalam, one of India's highest civilian honours, for your contributions to adventure sports, what was your
reaction to receiving this prestigious award and how has it impacted your career and professional life?

Ms Rachel: The day when the award was declared, I didn't see the paper myself, but a friend of mine
called me and said, "Your name is in the paper. You've received the Padma Shri." I replied, “No, no, no,
you’ve read it wrong.” So he said, “No, go ahead and see it.” I had the Times, and I looked at it, and it
was there. I was very, very happy. I had met Dr Kalam earlier in Bangalore when he was still a scientist.
He was not a president then. And I had spoken to him a lot. He had signed my jump log when I jumped
there in Bangalore. You see, we maintain a log book where each jump is recorded, and he signed it when
 3

I made a jump into Yelahanka, an airport in Bangalore. Back then, he was attending as a chief guest
alongside the minister, George Fernandez. Both of them had signed my logbook. So getting the award
from him was very precious.

Paridhi: It is truly monumental. I agree. So sports is something that adds a lot to a person's personality. It
helps one walk towards a positive bend of mind. Being a sportswoman, how do you think it has added to
your personality and helped you grow?

Ms Rachel: In skydiving, and particularly in adventure sports as a whole, everything happens in a

fraction of a second. You know, whether it's mountaineering, whether it's skydiving, whether it's hand
gliding, you're out there alone. And you have to make a decision. Sometimes the decision could be right.
Sometimes it could be wrong. The responsibility rests solely on you. Such experiences mould an
individual into a positive-minded person. If you've made a wrong decision, then you try to think fast
about how to get out of the problem. You're not going to say, I'll sort it out tomorrow. Because
everything is happening in seconds. Consider a jump from 10,000 feet; within a mere 45 seconds of free-
falling to 3,000 feet, precise body positioning becomes important. Any miscalculation could lead to an
unfavourable spin, demanding prompt corrections or adept techniques to get out of the problem. This
principle extends to all kinds of adventure sports, not just skydiving. Say you're out camping in a desert
or just taking a walk in the Rhabdo ranges, and then suddenly, there's a snake in front of you. You've got
to act; there’s no time to freeze or scream. You've got to decide what to do right there. It's the same deal
with any adventure sport, I'd say.

Paridhi: As you're describing, it seems like a really dangerous sport. Did you not face resistance from
both internal and external sources? Was not there a fear of what might happen once you got into it?

Ms Rachel: For me, it feels like I've been blessed in so many ways. I'd call it a gift from God only. My

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

husband didn't stop me from skydiving when I initially joined the basic course of 10 jumps. When I
started, I was already a mother of two kids.

Paridhi: So you started your skydiving journey after getting married and having children?

Ms Rachel: Yeah. I got married quite early. My parents got me married when I was very young. I had my
first two children—a son and daughter—at 18, followed by my second daughter at 25, and I skydived
when I was hardly 24 or 25. But you know, I always say, I look at life differently. God has created all of
us. He has a plan for you. He is the creator, and he is the one who calls you home. We are not in control
of anything. For example, we are sitting here, and the fan is above our heads. Can you guarantee that the
bolts won't suddenly unhook and fall on your head, causing an accident? Or say, when you are climbing
down a flight of stairs and all of a sudden, your feet get caught at the end of a step and you trip and go
flying down, leading to serious injury and a lifetime of paralysis. What has to happen, happens. So it
doesn't have to happen by doing an adventure sport or skydiving or riding a bike fast or cycling. Even a
cycling trip from Delhi to Mathura or Agra can be an adventure. Imagine the team setting out early in
the morning, cycling through the day to explore Mathura, and returning by evening. It's an adventure on
the highway. So, at the end of the day, these are the experiences that, I feel, shape your personality a lot.

Arin: It certainly brings back nostalgic memories. Ma'am, could you share your thoughts on the

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

4

significance of family support when one takes on such challenges?

Ms Rachel: My mother and my sister were always there for me throughout my journey. Later in life, as I
continued skydiving, there came a time when I needed to go to America to pursue advanced training on
the Coast because there were no facilities in the country for civilians like me to learn such skills within the
country. At that time, when I started skydiving, women were not even in the armed forces of the country.
Naturally, there were no facilities available for me to go and learn the skill. But I had a dream: I wanted
to get into competitions and represent India. But you can't go and represent a country just by 10 jumps.
To compete on an international level, one needs extensive training, a coach, proper equipment, and
guidance beyond the basic 10 jumps. So yes, you need the support of your family because you're not at
home for long intervals of time. Especially with young children—one being 10 and the other eight during
the early years of my serious involvement in the sport—it was challenging. However, with my mother and
sister being there to take care of my children, I found both practical assistance as well as peace of mind
and was able to carry on with my training. Unlike the present day, back then, you could not just pick up
your phone and make calls on WhatsApp or Zoom and say hi or check on the things happening back
home while you were busy training. Times were different then.
It was the snail mail era. It was the mid-80s; long before you all were born, there was a time when phones
did not exist.

Paridhi: So previously, there was a misconception that women were fit to play only certain types of
sports, like badminton or tennis. Nowadays, we see women playing all kinds of sports like football, golf,
cricket, et cetera. Do you feel, we as a society, are breaking the shackles of stereotypes faced by women in
the field of sports? You would be the perfect embodiment of that change.

Ms Rachel: For this. It's not only sports. I think women have broken the barriers in every domain. We
tend to focus on the urban educated lot. But if you go to the villages or the remote parts of the country,

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

you'll gain a better understanding of what I'm trying to say. I recall reading the story of a young girl from
Varanasi, barely 16 or 17, the eldest in her family. When her father, who was a pandit at the Shamshan
Ghat, passed away, she took on the responsibility. Since there was no male heir, she disguised herself as a
boy, performing all the rituals of the shamshan ghat, even the challenging task of breaking the skull (a
ritual in Hinduism where the skull of the deceased is hit with a bamboo stick out of the belief that it shall help
the departed soul get detached from any residual links with the world and descend to the heavenly realms
with peace). Imagine the courage she displayed at such a tender age. Also, we can consider the case of
female wrestlers in India. The first female wrestlers in our country had to impersonate males for a long
time, and their fathers never told anyone that they were girls until much later. I feel that girls have strong
willpower and can juggle both home and the outside world easily. They take care of home and hearth and
can also accomplish their passions and goals if provided optimal support from their families.

Arin: Ma'am, I'm amazed by your answers. Can you take us back to your maiden experience of
skydiving? And how did you feel before the first jump? And what was going through your mind?

Ms Rachel: I must have said my prayers a hundred times to begin with. My first jump also happened to
be my first flight. Imagine it's your first flight, and someone tells you to jump out of the aircraft. We were
taken up to nearly 5000 feet, and we had to approach a door. Of course, during our training, we did it
practically. During our training, we practised the motion of sitting at the door, saying 'go,' and then
 5

jumping out into the designated spot, assuming the correct position. In training, it felt somewhat
manageable. However, when it came to the real deal, my legs seemed to have a mind of their own.
When it had to happen, my legs just refused to cooperate; it felt like they were firmly stuck. The screws
securing them in place didn't make it any easier. I would lean out, then hesitate and come back in. This
continued until my instructor, aware of my automatic opening device, very assertively asked me to go,
and at the speed at which I jumped out, it felt like I flew faster than the small plane itself. Hanging from
the wings of the fixed-wing aircraft, my hands were sweating, and I fumbled to open my parachute. And
in my book, I’ve gone into greater detail. But let me tell you, this continued till the next three jumps, and
on the third jump, I didn't even release myself, so the instructor had to hang out, get out of the aircraft,
and literally push me down. And I was really disqualified. I was asked not to come back to skydive
anymore because I had not only put my own life at risk but also endangered all other members onboard
the plane alongside me. Everyone could have been killed that day because of me. I have talked about this
experience at great length in my book.

Paridhi: Excelling in any field demands utmost dedication and continuous hard work. The engagement of
Indians, particularly women, across multiple sports is on the rise. However, with the multitude of
responsibilities women need to balance, how do you think they can strike a harmonious balance between
family and sports? Any learnings from the sport that have transformed you and your mindset?

Ms Rachel: As I mentioned, the support of your family is very important. If you have children, then it is
also very necessary that you share a good and healthy understanding with them. While not everyone faces
the challenge of managing a family alongside a career in sports, it's a common reality for many. Mary
Kom is one such example. Just like me, she was also actively involved in her sporting career even when
she had children. But yes, there are very few such cases of female sportspersons who are simultaneously
shuffling between family and sports. In moments like these, having a good rapport with your family is
key. It helps them understand where you're coming from with your career choices and why they mean the
world to you. There'd be times when they don't fully grasp your talent and drive, especially when you're
frequently away for training and camps. So, to make them get it, it's crucial to share your journey openly.

Arin: What role has skydiving played in your personal life, and how has it helped you grow as a person?

Ms Rachel: It has taught me the art of making quick decisions. I'm not a laid-back person. So if I decide
to do something, I have to do it then and there. I cannot postpone it until tomorrow. There is no
tomorrow; it is now. I have to do it. I want to do something, and if I feel that I need to do it today, I'll do
it today.

Paridhi: So the word procrastination simply doesn't exist in your vocabulary?

Ms Rachel: Yes. I'll try to juggle and give myself time to make sure I do what I want.

Paridhi: So how did you counter any uncertainties or insecurities coming your way in the initial days of
your career.

Ms Rachel: Funds were always a problem. Getting sponsors for the sport, covering airfare, and buying
equipment wasn't easy. The government did step in at times, but there were moments in between when I

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

6

needed money for my airfare. I remember once my mother had to pitch in and pay for my ticket. These
were the real struggles, but I managed to face them.

Paridhi: Training in such a sport must come with its own set of costs. How did you manage that aspect?

Ms Rachel: Absolutely, the training itself doesn't cost much, but reaching the training location and
carrying out each jump does. Each jump is a learning experience. So when you do a jump, then the coach
will provide feedback, pointing out what I could improve. So every time you jump, you go and try
something new. It's a continuous process of trial-and-error. While you don't have to perfect it on the first
try, it might take a few jumps before you perfect it.

Arin: Now you have also trained many students in this field. What advice do you give to the students,
especially the female students, who may be hesitant to pursue adventure sports?

Ms Rachel: I've not trained people, but I have, of course, guided a lot of girls, young girls. Back in my
early days as a skydiver, I never knew the importance of media, and I never realised the need to
document my achievements or announce them because I did not pursue the sport to gain anything; I
pursued it for the sheer joy of it. I did the sport because I enjoyed it. I didn't realise then that it wasn't
favourable for me because very few people know about me and what I've done in life. So today, if I were
to tell someone that I'm India's first female skydiver, they'd be very puzzled, as if I were speaking Greek
or any other foreign language. Also, the fact that I did something like this back in 1979 makes it all the
more difficult for them to believe. I skydived on the North Pole in 2002, and in 2003, I broke my leg due
to a skydiving accident, and that was the last time I jumped. So I was bedridden for nearly nine months.
I had nine months of recovery, a perfect time to write and publish, but I missed that opportunity. I had
nine months, but I didn't do it. You know, I feel that god has a designated time and season for everything
to happen, and it happens when the time and seasons are right. I'm grateful to god that the book is finally

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

published now, especially when so many people around us went through testing times in the form of
anxiety, depression and other problems during COVID. I hope that people can draw motivation from my
book. My book is very motivational because I believe nothing is impossible. Life throws challenges our
way, but I've always approached them as battles to be fought. Every jump, for me, was a challenge, a
fight.

Giving up was never an option. If one path didn't lead to success, I'd tirelessly seek another until I
achieved my dream. I wanted to skydive in India because it was practically impossible for me to keep
travelling abroad each time I wanted to skydive. Therefore, I approached the Prime Minister's Office and
wrote to the Prime Minister, expressing my desire to skydive with our forces. He graciously granted me
special permission, and that's how I managed to skydive with the forces. It also happened to be the first
time a civilian skydived with the army.

Paridhi: Ma'am, what time was it in your career when you started receiving returns on the economic
aspect of it?

Ms Rachel: The sport is not exactlyy economical. No, you don't get it. It is not about returns; you can
only invest. It's not like cricket, hockey, football or any other commercial sport. I did not receive any
monetary benefit from it.
 7

Arin: And do you feel that this sport may have a potential economic impact in the future?

Ms Rachel: Yes, it does have potential. It's an expensive sport. Even still, its potential is challenged by the
lack of regular drop zones in our country. A drop zone is a place where people go to skydive, typically on
weekends. Imagine having a dedicated space for regular jumps—Friday evenings, Saturday mornings,
throughout the day on Saturday, and even on Sundays. During a long weekend, enthusiasts could clock
in 10 to 15 jumps, marking milestones in their journey. Each jump is precious, akin to how pilots log their
flight hours. Nowadays, the government is taking the National Aerosports Policy ahead and pushing
these sports forward, and the Aeroclub of India is working to create a lot of such opportunities for
youngsters. You know, if you do aviation, particularly aerosports, you get that adrenaline rush that you
need. So when you need that adrenal rush, then you will not be doing drugs, you will not be engaging in
any sort of antisocial behaviour. You won't feel the need to light up a cigarette, go to a pub or drink your
money away. Such is the power of adventure sports. I’ve seen it firsthand. I still remember when my son
graduated from St. Stephens, and started his first job, back in the 90s. He was earning around Rs. 10-20
thousand which was a lot of money, considering the period we're talking about. And youngsters then
never knew what to do with such a large sum of money. Some saved wisely, thanks to parental guidance,
while a majority preferred blowing up all their money in pubs and discos because they were seeking that
adrenaline rush that they were unable to find elsewhere. They tried to find it by drinking and going to
these places.

Aviation, including activities like hang gliding, microlight flying, and aeromodelling, offers a different
kind of thrill. You're building a small aeromodel, and then you're learning how to fly it, flying a drone, a
small drone, because you could use it for weddings to take pictures and things like that. Our government
is actively encouraging young people to explore these avenues, promoting a positive and exhilarating way
to spend their time and energy.

Paridhi: So on a parting note, do you have a message you'd like to give to the youngsters who have tuned
in?

Ms Rachel: You live life once, and if you have a dream, you should fulfill it. Just like how it was my
dream to fly like a bird, each one of us has different dreams So believe in your dream and live it. As I said
before, you live once, and nothing is impossible. Thank you for coming over and interviewing me.

Paridhi: Thank you so much, ma'am, for your time and knowledge. This was a truly insightful
conversation, and I'm confident that a lot of people are going to take away a lot of wisdom from your
words.

Ms Rachel: I would like people to read my book, and now it's in the bookstores, like I shared with you
earlier, and it is available online on Amazon as well. It's a very motivational book, and I've written it for
younger kids. haven't put a lot of technicalities about the sport, but I've penned down some of the
funniest and most lighthearted moments of my life, such as how once I smuggled a dog from Russia and
other mischievous things I've done. My skydiving journeys weren't just about the jumps; I stayed back to
enjoy and explore the culture of every country I visited as part of my training. I got to experience a
Russian wedding. How many people know what a true Russian wedding looks like? I also got to see the
beautiful Istanbul, although with a broken back. It is a very interesting book, not because it is my book,

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

8

but because I have done a lot of things in life and wanted to share the wisdom I gathered along the way
with people in the form of this book.

Arin: I can't wait to read that book.

Paridhi: Exactly. We will order one for us.

Ms Rachel: Thank you very much.

Arin: And, as we say, there's no tomorrow. It was an absolute blessing to have you with us, ma'am, today.
As we wrap up, thank you again for generously sharing your thoughts and experiences.
 9

Gender Equity and Perseverance

Asmita Ghosh

Introduction
Sports, at its essence, has no utility. If we take
out the viewership and the financial aspect,
cricket is essentially hitting a ball with a long
wooden object and boxing reduces to throwing a
couple of punches. However, the profound
psychology behind humans feeling pumped up
when they witness an engaging match between
two or more teams imparts the activity its unique
value. When the two teams represent two
communities, people belonging to those
communities identify and find reflections of What prompts the discussion
themselves in this spirited competition, thus
deepening this value further. about women breaking
stereotypes?
However, in the history of sports, recognition,
and acknowledgment were reserved In 1952, the resounding echo of women's
predominantly for the male contenders, their footsteps marked a groundbreaking moment,
exploits celebrated. It is only in more recent times when 17-year-old Nilima Ghose etched her name
that women have stepped into the spotlight as in history as the first woman to grace the
acknowledged sportspersons. Yet, beneath the Olympics, fearlessly sprinting in the women’s
surface, the biases continue to linger. Still, 100m and 80m races. Alongside her, Mary
sometimes as young as a 12-year-old nestled in D’souza Sequeira, a fellow athlete, lent her stride
their mother's basement continue to draw on to the 100m and 200m races. Even though both
isolated incidents, like the national women’s failed to qualify for the subsequent rounds, their
football team's defeat by an under-15 boys’ team journey crystallised into an everlasting legacy –
in the US, to perpetuate stereotypes against the trailblazers who paved the way for Indian
women being inept and uninspiring. With female athletes. To dispel any lingering
arguments coming from every side, a pivotal scepticism about women's prowess in sports like
question arises: whether the field of sports, too football, we encounter the story of Shanti
should bow down to the constraints of gender? Mullick, the harbinger of change in Indian
While many voices assert a resounding yes to the football. She not only shattered stereotypes but
question at hand, sportspersons who happen to also earned the title of the first female footballer
be women would beg to differ. from India to receive the prestigious Arjuna
Award.

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

10

However the sad reality continues to prevail: in Breaking barriers,

the shadowy domain of world sports, names like
Ghose, Sequeira and Mullick continue to linger
Reframing expectations.
in obscurity. Why does this indifference persist? In a candid interview, Mithali Dorai Raj, the
Why does the resonance of their achievements former captain of the women’s cricket team
fall silent in the wider global forum of athletic recounted her late teens when she discovered that
acclaim? There are a myriad of problems that setting a world record, a feat that should've
threaten the scope of development and progress sufficed for many, however, paled in comparison
in the arena of female athletics: the everyday to the performance of the Indian Men's Cricket
struggles of these female athletes range from Team in that particular calendar year. Her world
financial inadequacy, and diminished media record was overshadowed by the excessive and
coverage, to the looming saga of prejudice, all exclusive attention enjoyed by her male
pointing towards an endless cycle of systemic counterparts among the community of Indian
neglect. cricket fans. Undeterred, she went on to become
the youngest cricketer to score a double century
at the age of 19, the second player to score more
than 10,000 runs in women’s cricket, and has the
second-highest average ODI. Beyond individual
accomplishments, her stellar captaincy led Team
India to two World Cup finals. Even though
India could not lift the trophy, the sight of the
team's rise from the ashes solidified its global
perception as a cricket team to watch out for,
making an indelible mark in the world cricket
However, amidst this discourse, an landscape. However, behind every successful
uncomfortable truth begs to be paid heed to. sportsperson, lies the story of unique personal
Women indeed by biological design, face a battles.
unique set of challenges as compared to their
male counterparts. Women have a wider pelvis
that decreases mechanical efficiency, 10% lower
vital capacity than a man, 20% lesser blood
volume for the same body weight as a man,
experience menstruation that acts as a hindrance
for the woman and stresses the body out at a
faster pace amongst many other anatomical
differences. The unacceptance of the truth in
question leads to putting men on a pedestal and
women having to be “as good as them”. Could
we acknowledge the uniqueness of women's
physiological makeup while fostering an
environment where a woman's triumph is not
measured against a male benchmark? Do these
inherent differences, however, justify the
perpetuation of an unequal narrative?
 11

Sometimes it is more about fighting the demons

that have haunted you your entire life than
fighting the ones you meet along the way to
success. For Mithali, it was the demon of
underrepresentation that she had faced. Mary
Kom, on the other hand, battled a different
adversary in the form of poverty and lack of
familial support. She had to carry out her boxing
practices in secret, fearing her father's reaction
and dismissal of her ambitions. It was only after
she started competing in National
Championships, that she found the courage to
share her dreams and ambitions with her father.

Eventually, she gained her father’s support when

her father realised her passion for the sport. Her Conclusion
father, Tonpa, had told Indian Express in 2018
that there was a time when he couldn't financially Amidst the negativity around us, we can feel a
support her diet. Despite all the odds stacked subtle but perceptible shift in mindset when it
against her, she managed to become the first comes to supporting the female athletes around
Indian woman to receive gold in the Asian us. With a thousand barriers broken, a thousand
Championship at Incheon in 2014 and the first more are yet to be broken, and we still have a
Indian female boxer to receive gold at the long way to go. However, this is just the prologue
Commonwealth Games in 2018. Apart from these and it urges us to question the status quo. Can
two, she has earned several laurels for India in the we, as a society, be not just witnesses but active
field of boxing. MC Mary Kom is an Arjuna architects of an inclusive and empowering sports
awardee, recipient of the highest sporting honour culture? The next time a young girl dribbles a
in the country, the Rajiv Gandhi Khel Ratna basketball or swings a racket, can we
award, the Padma Shri, Padma Bhushan, and the acknowledge the potential she carries and the
second highest civilian award, the Padma barriers she may encounter, and commit to
Vibhushan. fostering an environment where her dreams can
flourish? When the Women's World Cup graces
She stands not only as a formidable athlete but as our television screens, will we simply switch
a role model, proving that passion, hard work channels, or will we embrace the opportunity to
and unyielding willpower can surmount any witness history in the making, supporting and
obstacle. With Mary Kom as a guiding star, a celebrating the achievements of our female
string of women, undeterred by societal athletes?
constraints, have followed, setting higher
expectations and inspiring countless aspiring
athletes. Trailblazers like Dipa Karmakar, PV
Sindhu, Sakshi Malik, Jhulan Goswami, and
newer entrants like Minnu Mani, Shaili Singh,
and Linthoi Chanambam are making an
optimistic mark in the Indian sports landscape.

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

ISSUE 1, VOL 1

HARNESSING
TECHNOLOGY
FOR GENDER
EQUALITY AND
SUSTAINABLE
DEVELOPMENT

featuring
MITALI NIKORE
World Bank Member
 13

In Conversation with Ms Mitali Nikore

For the second episode of the Live Interview series, we are honoured to host Ms Mitali, a venerable
professional and a prominent advocate for gender equality. Boasting a distinguished career with notable
tenures at Nikore Associates and the World Bank, Ms Mitali stands as a noteworthy figure in the realm of
Indian-UK achievements, having received acclaim as a recipient of the prestigious Indian-UK Achiever 23
and a Forbes 22 For 2022 distinction. She brings a wealth of experience and expertise to this exchange
offering invaluable insights into the intersectionality of Sustainable Gender Transformations (SGTs),
gender dynamics, infrastructure development, international development and the pursuit of Sustainable
Development Goals.

Swadha: Ma'am, the first question for you is, in what ways can artificial intelligence and machine learning
contribute to promoting gender equality in traditionally male-dominated fields like tech, finance etc.?

Ms Mitali: This is a very interesting question and it links completely with where we stand as a country
today on India's female labour force participation. So, first, let's look at history and then we can look to
the future as has been defined by a lot of these tech products such as AI or ML-based products. If you
look at the historical data from 1951-52 till 2017-18, India saw a continuous decline in the female labour
force participation rate, which was primarily driven by rural women. These rural women were exiting the
labour force in large numbers because the per capita income was improving educational outcomes, and a
lot of the women who would have been working were now studying. So, now in such a scenario, you were
seeing that women were exiting the labour force. Also, women did not see a structural transformation in
their jobs. They were always doing low-productivity agricultural type work and they continued to do that
over many decades. Whereas men moved out and moved into manufacturing and services, that's what we
are seeing from the data. When we talk to women's organisations and industries, we realise that that is
because there was a huge gap in skill training, i.e. the men were more ready to be skilled in the new jobs
that were being created. When the IT sector boom happened in India, it was the men who drove it and
the men who benefited from it, like the men who became engineers. I know that because my father was
one of those men, so I saw it. But we didn't see women for many decades come into it and now we are
seeing more and more women coming into the IT sector today. With the AI, ML and all of these new
startup-based products that are coming up in the digital era and the fourth industrial revolution that we
are experiencing, we need to train women from the start. Otherwise, it's going to be a similar story as we
have seen in the last few decades, where, whenever there was a structural shift in the economy, whether
it's towards manufacturing and services as happened in the 90s or towards the IT sector as happened in
the 2000s, women will not be able to participate in those jobs and will not be able to benefit from the new
types of jobs that are being created in this sector. So, we need a lot more investment in women's skill
training in STEM and then up-skilling for AI and ML-based jobs.

Arin: Why can’t the same situation be replicated in India?

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

14

Ms Mitali: This is happening in India!

Arin: So what about The World Bank in particular?

Ms Mitali: This applies to The World Bank in India. It applies to all the UN agencies, the ADB, and
other international organisations. If you see their staff today, it's largely women with great diversity. Not
only from a diversity point of view of having more women but having more women from different cities
and states such as tier one, tier two cities, tier three cities, it's all over. So, it can be repeated everywhere
and it is happening in India.

Swadha: Ma'am, the next question for you would be, what steps can be taken to ensure that technology
and digital platforms are designed with a gender-inclusive approach, taking into consideration diverse
needs and perspectives?

Ms Mitali: We recently published a paper with Nikore Associates and IT for Change where we have done
a study of women entrepreneurs and we've done consultations with 75-80 women entrepreneurs. These
women entrepreneurs are operating in the MSME sector. What is the barrier to reaching better markets,
reaching more consumers, and accessing supply chains? Nearly all of them said that this digital divide is
one of the biggest challenges that they are facing. Because at each stage, you need to understand a new
platform. Somewhere there is a digital payment platform; somewhere there is a digital marketplace like
Amazon or Flipkart, where they have to place their products. And all of these platforms, if we currently
look at them, are first of all designed by men. There are very few women in their teams, who are
designing their features. If you don't have a woman on the team, they're not going to think about what
women will need. So today if you ask me what a digital payments platform needs for women, maybe I
will not know because I'm not a digital payments expert. But surely a female digital payments expert will
be able to think about it. So this is how we need to place a gender lens very much on these platforms for
facilitating women's entrepreneurship, and employment, and you need to have a lot more women in the
team designing these platforms The digital divide needs to be taken into account because you have to see
that the majority of women accessing these platforms belong to well-to-do households. The number of
low-income women who access smartphones is very low. We've been doing consultations across Delhi-
NCR for another project, and we found that the digital penetration in Delhi-NCR, for example, is very
high, including smartphones amongst women. But then, when you compare it with some other, lower-
income groups or other parts of the country, the penetration starts to fall. So we need to compare, even
internally and geographically, what it is about being close to, say, a metro city that facilitates more access
and usage of smartphones amongst women versus, you know, small cities. Is it just social norms? Is it
income? There are many of these factors. So when these platforms are being designed, they have to
understand their users and they have to also understand their non-users so that they can attract the non-
users. And they have to provide alternatives. If you're doing a smartphone-based app, also do a feature
phone-based or a web-based platform so that those who don't have smartphones can access it on an
alternate platform. So, these kinds of thoughts need to be brought in for more inclusive development.

Arin: There is this one term that everyone is crazy about, and I am also very fascinated: sustainability.
Sustainability is the future, and what are your views on sustainability and the sustainable supply chain?

Ms Mitali: “Everyone has their own take on it.” Some people say it's about mitigation actions,
 15

adaptation actions, and resilience actions, and there are differences in these actions. You know,
mitigation is more about saying, “Okay, whatever, carbon pollution I am doing, let me do another action
to mitigate that impact.” So carbon credits are a mitigation action. An adaptation action is when we
assume that the climate is going to change, how do we adapt our behaviours or our investment patterns
to that change? Change is certain, but how do we adapt to it? So one way of thinking about adaptation is
through flood walls and sea walls. That's an adaptation action because you know sea levels are going to
rise, so how do you stop them from coming into your city, you come up with sea walls, so it's just an
adaptation action. And then you have resilience actions that, yes, the climate is changing, but to mitigate
that impact, let us have resilience actions like, for example, conservation of mangroves. That's a resilience
action because then you are making that particular ecosystem more resilient to climate change and trying
to reduce the impact of climate change. For me, sustainability is a mix of these three, but also something
that leads to a circular usage of resources. So you have a mix of mitigation, adaptation, and resilience
actions in a circular economy. That is my interpretation of sustainability. So, if you are manufacturing,
you should manufacture with recycled products. If you are producing anything new, you should be
looking at how to take some of something that is already produced, repurpose it, recycle it, reinvent it
and then sell it in the market. That could be in the form of secondhand clothes or cars, or it could also be
in the form of reusing and recycling the groundwater. It could be for resources like water, energy, etc. or
it could even be for goods. Now, how can you create more sustainable supply chains? It's through this
framework of a circular economy operating with mitigation, adaptation and resilience actions that your
entire trade should be driven by renewable energy. Transport systems in the trade, like trains with solar
panels, can run on solar energy. Why do we not have more of that? Why do we not have land ports that
are powered by solar energy rather than thermal power? Even in terms of our transport modes, we can
use rail or waterways instead of trucks for our actual logistics movements. Then, the goods that we are
transporting, what proportion of those are made of recycled material. When we start to check for these
specificities, we are doing a circular economic movement. So that is my interpretation of sustainability.

Arin: That was indeed insightful!

Swadha: Another question is, like you mentioned in your answer, that some social norms come with tech
and innovation and there is gender bias that also plays into it. All of these factors just make these new
emerging technologies inaccessible to many women and many weaker sections. So what steps can we take
to ensure that technology and digital platforms are accessible to women?

Ms Mitali: So the first thing is to have more digital literacy. I know it is so basic, but it is shocking. And
this is not about digital literacy, even at the school level. Yes, of course, we need that. But on top of that,
we also need skill-training centres. For all of our Skill India missions, we need to make digital literacy a
compulsory programme with all other programmes. If you are doing plumbing, you do plumbing but you
do 20 hours of digital literacy training because when you look at your smartphone first gender gap is in
access. But let's say you even have a smartphone. We have interacted with many women. They don't use
the smartphone for their work but rather for WhatsApp and calls to their friends, relatives and children.
You know many times the children are not in the same village, so they are calling up their children who
are in the city or even abroad. And they don't use it for their business, even though they might be having
a business. So why are they not using it? Because of the lack of digital literacy. So access, then usage and
being aware of how you can use your smartphone. And then the third is optimisation. One is that you
know that you have a WhatsApp business. The second is that you optimise the usage of WhatsApp

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

16

business. The second is that you optimise the usage of WhatsApp business to market your product. Send
that WhatsApp message with a nice graphic or with a lovely Canva image saying this is my sale and my
product. How many women are doing that? It's a very small minority. It's literally amongst the privileged
women who are doing. The ones who are cut off don't know any of these three levels. We need a lot of
soft skill training and digital literacy training at each level. And in a graded manner over the long term —
three, four, five years. NGOs should be funded and the government should stop doing the training on
their own as they have already done. Most of the skill training is happening in PPP mode. So one can
bring in community-based organisations that are sprouting from within the community and try to
support them more in the efforts that they are doing.

Arin: How do you think these policies that the government comes up with, have huge plans and a lot of
time is spent in their planning, but when it comes to execution, we are clueless.

Ms Mitali: I don't think it's that bad. I have spent a lot of time working on implementation with a lot of
government agencies. So no, it's not so bad. We have had a lot of progress in the last 10 to 15 years. And
I would say, across successive governments, we have made a lot of progress in making India the fastest-
growing economy. That's not happened just with the private sector. It's happened with both government
and private sector. Sure, the pace of implementation in the government is slow. But think about why. It's
because the government is dealing with taxpayer money. For the private sector, I don't even have to ask
anyone if I want to spend 20 rupees or 30 rupees over here, I'm going to spend. I don't even have to ask
anyone. It's my money. The government is spending your money. My money. So when they are deploying
that money anywhere, they have to be sure that there will be the right impact of that investment. And yes,
in many cases, we have seen that infrastructure is the one that is giving the best returns for government
investment because, in infrastructure, it is harder to bring in the private sector. So now, over the last 10
years, the investments that have happened in the Gati Shakti Programme, the investments that have
happened in building the national infrastructure pipeline and resulting in a lot of outputs: new ports and
airports are coming up, they are catalysing private investments as well. So the combination of
government and private investment has worked very well in highways, ports, airports, and land ports
now. And slowly that will grow. So now the government is in a position where since the private sector is
so interested in transport, connectivity and energy infrastructure, they can change their focus towards
renewable energy. Because that is one sector that needs a lot of government support again to catalyse the
private sector to come in. And second is to look at social development. How can we make our cities more
gender-inclusive? How can we create more safety infrastructure for women in public spaces? How can we
bring in more infrastructure that is disability-friendly? So I think these are two main areas where climate
resilient infrastructure, infrastructure to support all these climate actions, mitigation, adaptation,
resilience and to make cities more livable in the urban spaces is needed. Both of these are now very
important. Governments can also start thinking about the infrastructure sites looking at how we can
conserve some green spaces, and make them public land so that they are not developed.

Swadha: Ma'am, what is your take on green bonds?

Ms Mitali: They work. That's my take. Green bonds are very effective as long as you have the right
partner on the ground. There have been instances where green bonds have been invested in solutions that
have not really worked. So it depends upon the right innovation in green technology. Say, for example,
electric vehicles. Today, it's a very simple and safe green bond investment because we know that electric
 17

vehicle markets are going to grow. So, whether you are investing in a charging infrastructure or the
development of an EV, that is a great way to deploy your money in a green bond. But then there are
other technologies in the carbon capture space, for example, that may not work. So then again, the green
bond could fail. So I think as long as the investments of a green bond are sufficiently diversified, they go
for investments in areas which are sufficiently proven and have effective partners on the ground, then a
green bond can work very well. Because it's a great way to leverage financing for developing countries
when one is trying to bring in climate finance.

Swadha: Ma'am, what is your take on green bonds?

Ms Mitali: They work. That's my take. Green bonds are very effective as long as you have the right
partner on the ground. There have been instances where green bonds have been invested in solutions that
have not really worked. So it depends upon the right innovation in green technology. Say, for example,
electric vehicles. Today, it's a very simple and safe green bond investment because we know that electric
vehicle markets are going to grow. So, whether you are investing in a charging infrastructure or the
development of an EV, that is a great way to deploy your money in a green bond. But then there are
other technologies in the carbon capture space, for example, that may not work. So then again, the green
bond could fail. So I think as long as the investments of a green bond are sufficiently diversified, they go
for investments in areas which are sufficiently proven and have effective partners on the ground, then a
green bond can work very well. Because it's a great way to leverage financing for developing countries
when one is trying to bring in climate finance.

Arin: Ma'am, do you think that technology-enabled remote work and flexible work arrangements for
women have not only increased their participation in the corporate sector but also got them greater work
opportunities like finance and a sense of security?

Ms Mitali: We have recently partnered with IWWAGE and Zoom to work on a study on hybrid work in
India, which is a Nikore Associates partnership. As part of that study, IWWAGE surveyed women
professionals in India, and Nikore Associates did a policy review where we reviewed policies across 60
countries and 178 companies we found very interestingly that 60% of the countries had a national-level
hybrid work policy, but none of them had a gender lens. They did not mention women as a separate
interest group, they did not mention women's considerations or anything. Similarly, when we look at the
company policies of 178 companies across these 60 countries, 138 companies had a hybrid work policy.
Again, none of them mentioned women as a separate group or any of the issues that women may
encounter at the workplace within that hybrid work policy. And it is interesting that nobody considers
women to be a separate group. Now, what are the issues of women when it comes to hybrid work?
Firstly, women are 50% more likely to choose hybrid, flexible work or work from home or even a job that
is 100% remote than men. So, automatically, any policy that is focused on hybrid work or flexible work is
disproportionately going to impact women as compared to men. None of these policies at the national
level in a government policy or at a private level in the company recognise this. Secondly, what are the
major issues with hybrid work for women? Firstly, it’s pay parity. Many companies state that for remote
work, they should be paying less. Secondly, the types of roles that are getting the remote function are
often those that are done in the background or maybe they are the more junior roles. nd then more senior
people have to be in the office, in front of the client or a sales meeting. So then, if women are performing
more remote work, they are getting relegated to less revenue-generating job roles and more cost centres

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

18

and therefore more precarious can be a gig worker than full-time work. So all of these issues then crop
up, which are not addressed by these policies whatsoever. The third is around skill training. What is the
path for remote workers? Yes, you are performing a job today, but what is your growth path and is
taking up remote work disadvantaging you in any way in your career progression in the company or even
outside the company? Nothing is mentioned in these policies. And then the fourth aspect is with respect
to care work. If you are taking up remote work, are you allowed to have a flexible day or is it that the
timings are the same and then you are just working from home? And how do you adjust your care work
requirements around flexible work and remote work? None of these policies deal with it at all. So there is
a lot of work to be done concerning making flexible work policies, remote work policies, and hybrid
work policies much more gender-sensitive. Recognise that there may be some special circumstances that
women are facing, which can be stated in gender-neutral language. That's fine. You can always use the
language of a caregiver or parent instead of a mother or female employee. But at the same time, when
you at least put these issues in the policy, you know they are going to disproportionately benefit women.
So there is a lot of work to be done and in fact, the big challenge in this area is that there is no global best
practice because our review was global. We looked at 60 countries, we looked at 178 companies and this
is global and this does not exist anywhere, in any country. So I think for us, this is a very big finding.

Swadha: Ma'am, when you try to put all three narratives together: emergent technologies, environment,
and gender biases against women. So, all of these three looked very independent overall. So, how do you
think that this scenario right now overlaps in India?

Ms Mitali: So, green technology does not employ a sufficient number of women. It overlaps. To end
with, I want to thank all of you from The Economic Society, SRCC. You guys are doing an amazing job
and I'm honoured to be featured on your list with other stalwarts that you mentioned. Thank you so
much for taking the time to come here.

Arin and Swadha: Thank you so much.

 19

Harnessing Technology for Gender

Equality and Sustainable Development
Gulnar Bharati
For example, whene­ver you are making
Introduction something new, aim to repurpose or recycle an
Technology has the potential to play a crucial existing item. This might involve selling pre­-
role in achieving the goal of gender equality and owned clothes or vehicle­s. It could even be about
sustainable development in the present age. It recycling groundwater. Either way, reuse­ should
could help us to achieve these goals by enhancing be the key consideration. This framework can be
efficiency and promoting innovation. From extended to create sustainable chains as well.
renewable energy solutions to smart agricultural
practices, technology is at the forefront of
sustainable development efforts worldwide. For
example, new green technologies include carbon
capture and storage systems, more efficient
irrigation methods, essential medicines,
household water purification devices, and
manufacturing processes that minimise waste and
pollution. Features such as low cost, low usage of
fossil fuels, and use of locally available resources
can give some advantages in terms of
sustainability. For that reason, these technologies Women in Technology
are sometimes used and promoted by advocates
of sustainability and alternative technology. The role of technology in sustainability is
evident, yet it's important to acknowledge the
Now, the fourth industrial re­volution is upon us. historical underrepresentation of women in this
It's marked by digital technology taking centre field, stemming from past structural shifts in
stage. Tools like­ artificial intelligence, the­- society where women were confined to lower-
Internet of Things (IoT), and big data analytics paying agricultural roles while men transitioned
can tweak how we­ use resources and boost to higher-paying industrial and service sectors,
sustainable development by making supply chain resulting in a significant skill gap, even in modern
management systems be­tter. A concept that has sectors like the IT industry in India dominated by
long captivated widespread fascination is men, thus emphasizing the need for inclusion and
sustainability. In the broadest sense of the word, empowerment of women in emerging fields like
it refers to the ability to maintain or support a Artificial Intelligence (AI) and Machine Learning
process continuously over time. It is a (ML) now coming to the forefront, we need to
combination of mitigation, adaptation, and train women for this new structural shift. Or else
resilience actions in a circular economy. It is they will not be able to proportionately avail
leads to a circular use of resources. benefits

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

20

from this change like the ones before as well. To

do this, we need more investment for women in
STEM so that they too can find positions in the
so-called "non-traditional" areas such as
transportation, energy, or even international
organisations. We need to have a gender-inclusive
approach everywhere in general but in terms of
technological relations, in particular here. The
digital divide is one of the biggest setbacks for
women, especially from underprivileged
backgrounds. At every stage they are expected to the International Solar Alliance (ISA)
understand a different platform, be it digital demonstrate the transformative power of
banking or a digital marketplace. Furthermore, technology in bringing expertise together
most of these platforms are usually designed by globally. The ISA is an alliance of more than 120
men. For example, Amazon was laid out by Jeff signatory countries. The primary objective of the
Bezos, and Paytm was designed by Vijay Shekhar alliance is to work for the efficient consumption
Sharma. We need to, therefore, place a gender of solar energy to reduce dependence on fossil
lens on these platforms, and increase the fuels. It enables the sharing of valuable insights
representation of women in the programming and best practices for implementing sustainable
team so that they can define and redefine the energy solutions. The use of technologies in this
position of women in the said sector. area not only accelerates the deployment of
renewable energy but also makes global climate
Vandana Shiva's advocacy for biodiversity and change mitigation efforts more efficient and
sustainable agriculture has had a global impact, effective.
while the Wangari Maathai Greenbelt movement
empowered Kenyan women to lead reforestation To leverage climate financing, green bonds also
efforts as an example of women's participation in come into the picture. They play a vital role in
community
. development. Moreover, global the interface between technology and sustainable
initiatives such as HeForShe, supported by the development. These bonds have been established
UN emphasise the importance of gender equality specifically for financing projects that contribute
for overall sustainability. By ensuring equal to environmental sustainability, such as
educational and economic opportunities, gender renewable energy projects and environmentally
equality is inclusive and benefits families and friendly projects. Blockchain technology and
communities. It acts as a catalyst for sustainable digital platforms enable the solicitation of funds,
development, harnessing the full potential of ensuring that capital raised through green bonds
human capital. is indeed allocated to projects that have a positive
impact on the environment. In a world grappling
challenges of climate change, green bonds are a
Facilitating Global Co-operation bridge between technology and sustainable
development. Promoting inclusivity and
Technology also continues to emerge as a key empowering women fuels equitable and
facilitator of international cooperation. In the interconnected development.
field of renewable energy, initiatives such as
ISSUE 1, VOL 1

RETHINKING
EDUCATIONAL
NARRATIVES

featuring
KUNWAR S VIJENDRA
Chairman, ASSOCHAM
22

In Conversation with Mr Kunwar S Vijendra

Greetings, and welcome to the third episode of our live interview series. Today, we are privileged to host Mr
Kunwar Shekhar Vijendra, a distinguished social entrepreneur who serves as the co-founder and chancellor
of Shobhit University in India. Mr Vijendra occupies pivotal leadership roles in various organisations,
notably as the Chairman of the National Council on Education of ASSOCHAM, India's oldest apex
chamber of commerce and industries. Furthermore, he provides mentorship to the Center for Education
Growth and Research (CEGR), the largest independent academic think tank in India. Mr Vijendra stands
as a dedicated proponent of education accessibility, the promotion of secular values, crisis resolution through
diplomatic means, and the establishment of a globalised learning system for peaceful coexistence. The focal
point of our discussion today is the decolonisation of education.

Paridhi: To begin the conversation, would you like to shed some light on the notion of decolonisation of
education and why it holds significance in the present day?

Mr Shekhar: First of all, thank you both of you for coming here and meeting me.
Secondly, the term's meaning eludes me, especially in the context of education, since education here was
never colonised. We might have borrowed a model, but our education system has evolved with time,
incorporating adaptations. Historically, it happens. It was not that somebody forced us. In the last few
years, many corrective measures have been taken. These corrective measures are happening in the
country in totality, not only in one sector. So, if you look at the National Education Policy, then you can
see a corrective measure has been taken and it is going to change all those practices which historically
were adopted. Now, they are not required anymore.

Arin: Sir, considering the dynamic shift that is happening in the corporate world, in the rapidly changing
job market, how can we prepare students for careers that don't even exist yet, be it in the spheres of AI or
machine learning? How can we prepare students for the future?

Mr Shekhar: Actually, what is happening is that we are talking about the future and the future is going to
have an unknown sector that even industry does not know. A few months back, the notion of an AI
model, such as ChatGPT, seemed outlandish. Now, it's a hot topic, with concerns about job displacement
and what unfolds tomorrow is uncertain. What I will always say and believe is that we have a very
important role now. We have to develop a fluid-skill mindset for our boys and girls. It means that we
have to come out of the course curriculum. It is instrumental to know the past, the foundation and the
subject because significance lies in thinking beyond, encouraging a forward-looking perspective and
being a visionary. It means critical thinking and soft skills like communication, collaboration, etc. have
to be worked on. When universities embrace holistic development, as is advocated by the New Education
Policy, change is bound to happen.

Paridhi: So, since you brought up NEP, implementation is often the biggest challenge when it comes to
almost all of the policies. Being the first batch subject to the reforms initiated by the NEP, we have been
 23

grappling with issues in the curriculum, academic schedules and more. What steps, do you think, are
crucial for smoother implementation and what might be missing?

Mr Shekhar: Actually, you know when a policy comes after a very long time, it means that there has been
a gap and we are trying to bridge that gap in the shortest period possible. In 2020, the NEP was
introduced. After around 1000 days have elapsed, we have tried to delve into its meaning, pace, the
purpose it wants to serve and unravel its impact. India is a country of diversity, even in education if we
look at what is happening at Delhi University or SRCC from where both of you are coming, the same is
not happening at Meerut University, or universities in Gujarat or Punjab, things there are different.
The biggest challenge that I feel is that we have to train the trainers. Teachers’ training has to be
prioritised. What our young assistant professors understand about technology, our old professors do not
understand. They are so accustomed to the conventional methods that they are finding it difficult to
adapt. As the first batch, despite struggling, I am sure you people must also be enjoying the possibilities
of something new happening and historically you will be the first batch, the pioneers, who suffered but
who made the National Education Policy successful.

Arin: Also, the NEP encourages, rather stresses a lot on the importance of foreign universities
establishing their campuses in India. How do you foresee this implication of not just foreign universities
but also private universities impacting overall education in India?

Mr Shekhar: These are two questions. Let me start with the private education one. You know, private
university is a term whose origin we do not know.

Like if I look at the UGC Act 1956, it speaks about three types of universities: central universities,
deemed universities and state universities. Who is funding the university does not make a difference. Even
private universities are doing well. Today, when we look at the contribution of private universities to the

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

complete educational ecosystem, it is larger than our state or government-funded universities. So, if you
look at the impact that is there, you think to yourself, why is it there? It is because anybody who is
putting money, effort and his or her life into establishing an organisation has a clear vision of what they
want to do. So, maximum private universities, if I use the same word, are universities funded by
individuals, not by the government. They are doing better because they are working in certain specific
areas. More innovation is unfolding, more research is happening, all of that. They know their area of
expertise. There is one university in NCR, which is working in liberal arts. They think that if we are good
at law, we will work in legal studies. And they are doing well. They are giving competition to those who
have had very established faculties of law for decades. So, there is no such difference between private
universities and non-private universities, or government universities, I think they have to go hand-in-
hand, they have to work together and they have to bring change.

Paridhi: Sir, but when it comes to the private and the government, the type of students being enrolled in
all of these universities, like, varies completely.

So, I think, the path that you follow once you’re in a private college and once you’re in a government
college are two different journeys which happen, maybe because of the fee structure that they follow,
which will automatically be associated with the faculty coming there and all of the other factors.

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

24

Mr Shekhar: That may be one thing, but today I look at, say, Delhi University which admits a student
through CUET, and Shobhit also. At Shobhit, the seats have been filled, and in DU the admission
process is still going on. It means there is something, right? And where the fee structure comes in, you will
appreciate in which end the fee structure of IIMs, of IITs, and the majority of these schools in private,
they are giving more or less the equal facilities, they are giving better exposure, and their fee structure is
less than IIMs You know, you are, both are coming from an economics background. Yes? So, how the
economy works, as it works in the society, the same way it is working in the education sector.

To answer the second part of your question about international universities. Actually, to be very honest, I
do not know how they are going to add value to our Indian ecosystem. Harvard is not coming, at least as
of now. Stanford, MIT, Cambridge and Oxford are not coming. Having Deakin University and
Bulangong University, they are not going to play. They had their shops over here. I am sorry to use this
word. It is very harsh. They were recruiting students from here. Yes, if they are going to contribute to the
research area and innovation area, then definitely we will welcome them. Otherwise, we all have no use
for these universities. We are doing grand research, faculty development, exchange programs and a lot of
things. But, the government may be having some reason, which I may not be aware of, for how this
change will come. We can appreciate it. (Hum toh maante hai Vasudev Kutumbakam) Let them come, and
let them also play their role, in the growth of our ecosystem.

Arin: You mentioned this aspect of the rich culture, of the Vasudev Kutumbakam as it is fondly said. So,
how can we balance preserving the rich heritage of Indian education, while modernising and
internationalising the curriculum to meet the needs of the future of the Vasudev Kutumbakam as it is
fondly said? So, how can we balance preserving the rich heritage of Indian education, while modernising
and internationalising the curriculum to meet the needs of the future?

Mr Shekhar: Okay, I don’t know how much curriculum was internationalised by Germany, Japan or

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

Korea. At the end of the day, it comes down to where the majority have to work. And that is the Indian
ecosystem. So, if I am teaching something, for example, I am teaching French to 100% of my students,
but the size of France is equal to one of, actually, even lesser than that of my state. We have to take good
practices out of that. And before that, what I always say, is we have 1100 plus universities. Every
university has at least one good practice.
We have to develop an ecosystem, where these 1100 good practices, come together. Something that DU is
doing well, should be taught to my team. Similarly, what Shobhit is doing good should be appreciated by
other universities.
So, once we do that, things will start changing. Where employment is concerned, we are working
globally. Demographically, there is an imperative for our people to possess skills that are globally
appreciated.
In your initial question, you highlighted the uncertainty regarding future skill requirements. This
underscores the necessity for holistic development. We need individuals who understand and have a fluid
skill mindset. We need people who have all that content in them, which would make them a good
professional. They will learn what is required.

Paridhi: Sir, moving to ASSOCHAM, what role does ASSOCHAM have to play in the education sector?
 25

Mr Shekhar: ASSOCHAM is the oldest chamber of commerce. More than 100 years, with lakhs of
people around, those who are, you know, industry people. The idea of having an education council in
ASSOCHAM is to connect education with industry. This is one role. Secondly, in policy-making, the
government always seeks a lot of opinions from people around, especially from chambers like
ASSOCHAM, FICCI, and all those chambers. So, what do we do? We have a lot of members,
universities, and other people. There is a task force for school education also. The idea behind this is to
facilitate the implementation of government policies and align the needs of the industry. So, we provide a
platform, to the industry, so that it can convey its expectation from the universities, and what they expect
from the industry. We also provide certain policy notes and white papers to the government outlining
essential requirements and proposing collaborative strategies to ensure that good policies, which are
active for industry, academia as well as the government system, are in place.

Arin: Sir, the NEP, besides emphasising the role of students, also caters to the importance of a well-
trained teaching workspace. So, how can we ensure that our teachers are adequately prepared, and not
just the students?

Mr Shekhar: This is a big challenge. It happens because we have insufficient infrastructure for teachers.
So the government emphasises a lot on the incorporation of a teacher's training program by every
university. But to teach a teacher also, we need trainers. So, a lot of activities are happening at the
universities. But still, this is a challenge. And especially, as I mentioned, young teachers, those who are
supposed to join now, are well aware, enthusiastic and want to do it. But changing the people, those who
are coming from the oldest group is tough. So, we have to use their wisdom and experiences. But for the
change, and whatever has to come, we have to depend more on the younger part. So, a lot of efforts are
there like NC, the National Council for Teacher Education. They have also changed the curriculum, the
B.Ed program is changed and a lot of other changes are happening.
So, we are trying, it will take time, but it will happen.

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

Paridhi: So, because this has become like a real problem in all of our universities, in both private and
government colleges I’d say that people are getting teachers at the end of the semester, and then the
curriculum being completed in like 15-20 days.

Mr Shekhar: Unfortunately, it is happening. Yeah, so.

Arin: It's not just the dearth of quality, but also the quantity of teachers that is affected.

Mr Shekhar: Would you like to be a teacher? Be honest.

Arin: That would be a tough state for me right now.

Mr Shekhar: Yes. And what about you, Paridhi?

Paridhi: No.

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

26

Mr Shekhar: This is the challenge. Our ministers and bureaucrats often go to learn from Finland,
renowned for its education system, you know, for visits. So, what is the difference between Finland's
social system and India's? The highest-paid person over there is a teacher. The most respected profession,
historically in India was teaching, but in actuality, it is not in India. (Jab koi teacher banta hai, kya kehte
hai? Accha kuch aur naukri nahi mili hogi.) So, becoming a teacher for most is not by choice. Many times
it is out of compulsion. This mindset has to be changed. Every year, on the 5th of September, we all stand
and say, "Guru Govind dou khade, kaake alnghu paye, balihari Guru apne Govind diyo bataye". But
actually, are we giving that respect to this profession? No. If there is no inspiration, role model or
compensation, then definitely, bright young boys and girls will not be willing to teach. So, this challenge
is there, and the government is working on that. So let’s see and hopefully, with time, this change will also
come.

Arin: What role does the government in particular towards increasing the monetary compensation along
with what the private sector can do for teachers? And addition to that, the budget 2024 announced the
highest-ever allocation to the education sector, but it was still, around 2.9% of the GDP, which is way
below the ideal 6% ratio.

Mr Shekhar: In a way, if we look at the salary part, it is at par with an IAS officer. A lot of things are
there. So the monetary part if we look at it, is not small. In private universities, salaries are even higher
because their market force is larger. What you deserve, you get. So, that's not the thing. And when we
look at the government's contribution or what has been decided in the budget, a lot of compensations are
there. We appreciate that. The government wants to bring the change. And you know, that change will
come from a student also. So, there is a 3-H theory, it is not related to budget but I still have to use that.
Head, Heart, and Hand. The best thing about NEP is, that it is integrated. Okay. What is that? Holistic
development, when we talk about it, means that we have to ensure that our boys and girls are good
critical thinkers from the head. They are good human beings. Moral education and a lot of things have

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

been integrated. The hand is the application of skills. Skills are the most important thing. What we were
not talking about earlier. I have seen a lot of boys of commerce who can’t read balance sheets because it
was never given. It is like, I am learning swimming but I have never been in the swimming pool. The skill
set has to be integrated closely. GDP will increase when we have a lot of skills.

Paridhi: So then brain drain comes in like with an increase in skills.

Mr Shekhar: Brain drain is not there. We should use a different word now, Paridhi. Every sixth person in
this world is an Indian. It means every sixth employee by this logic has to be an Indian. So we have to see
this thing very positively. We are the people the world cannot avoid. It is almost like we are omnipresent.
Now you should feel proud. Right? The British prime minister is of Indian origin. Many other people
around you, when you look at them, are of Indian origin. Why? Shall we call it brain drain? We
shouldn't. Brain drain is when people are not available here and people are going there. “Ghar mein
bhookh lagi hai and padosi ke yaha mein jaake khaana bana raha hu yaa khaana de raha hu". That is brain
drain. But now the situation has changed. Demographically we cannot afford it, we don’t have so much
employment. Global opportunities are there. We have to become global citizens. And I am sure that in
our new education system, young boys and girls are going to conquer the world with their skills and their
knowledge.
 27

Paridhi: So like coming back to the 6% mark that NEP suggests, is it an overstatement in NEP or like are
we not yet there to be able to fulfil that 6% investment mark?

Mr Shekhar: Shall I comment on that? I am poor in economics.

Paridhi: Yes.

Mr Shekhar: Because these are aspirations. And definitely, aspirations are fulfilled. Because we are
working on them. So immediately on a short note, it may not look like it is happening. But yes, it is going
to happen.

Arin: Now sir, it is my favourite question. If you had the opportunity to completely revamp or reimagine
the Indian education system what would it be from scratch?

Mr Shekhar: You know if I had this opportunity the first thing we would do was to go to the smallest
villages and see our grand heritage culture. Sitting in Delhi, talking about NEP, universities,
internationalisation, globalisation and all these things is very easy. 100 km from Delhi, there are schools
which are lacking basic infrastructure. You know the foundation is not strong for whatever we are
building, we are having a change in jobs. So the most important thing is to look at the ground level and
ensure a sturdy infrastructure for primary education in all those schools. You know there is a paradox.
This paradox has to be changed. Once I am out of school, I want to go to a government university like
DU. But when I was in school, I never wanted to go to a government school. That has to be changed. I
hail from the small town of Saharanpur in Uttar Pradesh. I am happy to share that 99 years back, in
1924, the first-ever school in that region was founded by my grandfather. And it is still doing great. A lot
of people have come out, politicians, bureaucrats, educationists, and technocrats and they are working
globally. And it is a small initiative. 99 years ago, it was a small initiative but it has brought a change. So,

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

what I always say is that you might hail from any place and have an opportunity to work anywhere, but
ensure that your roots are strong. Go back. You don't need to establish a school. But in the education
system, the most important things are aspiration and inspiration. Both have to work. You are coming
from a big city, but your father may be from a small place. The same may be true with you. Yes? Go to
those schools and just talk. Because this country was always lacking what we knew the best, storytelling.
The honourable Prime Minister has started Man Ki Baat and all other initiatives. You know, in
education also, we have to go back and talk to those boys and girls, the ones who do not dream because
they have not seen anything. Maybe I would like to bring that change. The foundations will be good.
Everything will be great.

Paridhi: So, education has been in your family for generations now. So, lastly, my question would be
what does a typical day in your life look like given that you are heading so many things all at once and
making big decisions affecting so many stakeholders?

Mr Shekhar: You know, when I was your age, I was a different man. Ten years back, when I was in my
forties, I was different. I used to feel a lot of tension and stress. Now, I am fifty-five. So, life is very easy.
Because I know that two things are very important. Art to delegate and art of gratitude. Yes? So, my day
starts with gratitude. To everybody, to nature, God and everything. My self, my health and my body.

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

28

And to delegate, once you have a good team, a lot of things start happening. Otherwise, yes, a lot of
things have to be done. The most important thing that I try to do, apart from all these things, is to always
wish and try my best to remain connected with my roots. Like when Ramlila started, I was the person
who went to my village on its inaugural because it reminded me of my childhood. It gives me faith.
Whatever I am doing, my roots are very strong. And maybe you are not aware, we have two universities.
One is in Meerut, which is a deemed university. And the second university is in our town. It is a state-
private university. And we established it there because we knew that when I was a student, I used to
travel a lot. 90% of the girls were not allowed. Because of how they would go, neither the transport was
good nor the roads were good. I am delighted to share that students from Delhi, Maharashtra, and
various other regions are now choosing to pursue their studies there. So, the scenario has changed.
Things have changed. So, this is what has done that.

Arin: Thank you so much. It was a great experience.

Mr Shekhar: So, thank you very much. Wish you all the best.

Paridhi: Thank you so much for your time and for answering all of our questions.
 29

Decolonisation of Education
Ananya Sharma

cultural milieu. Gandhi argued that colonial

Introduction education system was a citadel of slavery that
denied learners crucial lessons in liberty and self-
Colonisation had a profound influence on not
respect. His idea of education aimed to facilitate
just India's political and economic landscape, but
a democratic life and economic self-sufficiency
also left an enduring mark on its educational
rather than one that perpetuated older systems of
framework. The British characterised the
dependence and inequality. He attempted to
indigenous Indian Education system as brute,
counter colonial education by Nayi Talim (New
unprogressive and the reason for India’s
Education), which focused on helping colonised
economic and cultural backwardness. It was
citizens achieve economic and political liberty. It
disregarded and replaced by the European system
promoted small, self-reliant communities and
of education in 1835. The colonial education
cooperation to become the norm as that ideally
system glorified the British conquests and
represented the authentic essence of India. Why
influenced the youth into believing that the
was Nayi Talim not widely accepted then?
modern European culture was more empowering
and liberal than their own. Objections towards
this system began to emerge in the early twentieth
century as people realised that it served the
British rather than the citizens.

Major Challenges and Reforms

The caste strife in India had worsened and led
many leaders to believe that the colonial system
was the solution to break away from the
Decolonisation, in the context of education, is the Sanskritic-hegemonic Brahmanical system of
process of undoing colonial practices that have education. Moreover, decolonisation became the
influenced education in a colony. Education is motto of religious nationalism, where minority
crucial due to the fact that it provides relevant communities began to be considered major
knowledge and skills to citizens. The impact of hindrances to overall growth. There is a huge
seemingly progressive European modernity was difference between uncritical worship
demeaning the socio-cultural essence of the
colonised, casting a formidable shadow over their

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

30

of a glorified version of our past and actual certain extent but failed to have the planned
unbiased retelling of our history, which was impact. English continued to be the preferred
undoubtedly lost in the spirit of nationalism in language for education as well as the workplace.
the post-independence era. The saffronisation of Its suggestion of spending 6% of the country’s
education was a key contributing factor that that budget on education was not taken into
caused Nayi Talim and other decolonisation consideration. It was, however, successful in
models to be relegated to the periphery. The stratifying the education sector into national
European Education System was effective in bodies, state bodies and the central board. Later,
terms of standardisation and ease of evaluation of the National Education Policy envisaged the
one's capabilities. So, it was hard to revert to the opening of Navodaya Vidyalayas to support high
subjective indigenous system after the adoption of achievers, along with the universalisation of
a more uniform system. However, the purpose of elementary education and emphasis on women’s
colonial education was not only to prepare education. These reforms were made in the right
educated individuals to facilitate their economic direction, but the inadequate budget and other
exploitation but also to replace the indigenous shortcomings limited their extent of operation.
values and beliefs with European norms and
standards under the pretence of “civilising” them.
Instead of nurturing free thinkers, reformers and
leaders, it aimed to produce service-class
employees for the benefit of the colonisers.

By the end of the twentieth century, the world

had left colonisation behind. After long freedom
struggles and strife, almost 150 nations gained
independence and became full members of the
United Nations. The first step of decolonisation
was to rearticulate the ideologies and propaganda Present Scenario
imposed on the people. Educating the youth, who
would shape the future of our nation, was of
In the current scenario, Nipun Bharat is an
utmost importance. This could be done by
initiative by the government that aims to drive
teaching the complete truth of our history of
education transformations. The recent education
struggle. British imperialism, persecution, cultural
reforms proposed have drastically changed the
oppression - everything that has shaped our
education sector in India. The New Education
present. Although the framework of the
Policy 2020 covered a wide range of issues
education system was kept essentially the same as
ranging from infrastructural support to
the colonial one, curriculum changes were made.
expanding the pathways available for students. It
Education reforms have been proposed from time
emphasised skill enhancement and experiential
to time to keep the system updated according to
learning, along with promoting regional
changing requirements.
languages as the medium of instruction. It further
reduced the pressure on students by dividing the
A major reform towards the decolonisation of
system on the basis of 5+3+3+4 division of the
education was made by the Kothari Commission
curriculum. In theory, NEP 2020 was a
(1964-66), which intended to promote regional
phenomenal initiative that would result in long-
languages in the country. It was implemented to a
term impact. However, its implementation posed
 31

Rabindranath Tagore's vision of education

encouraged holistic development of a person. He
believed that education must nurture a child's
physical, emotional and intellectual capabilities
while providing space for creativity. In this era of
globalisation, adopting Tagore's philosophy will
truly benefit the education system. To some
extent, his ideals have been implemented in the
present. The Government has also incorporated
some aspects of the Nayi Talim proposed by
Gandhi, like self-reliance and imbibing cultural
values in children.
various problems. There was a major gap in the
existing infrastructure and the infrastructure
necessary for adopting these changes. The
majority of the teaching staff was not proficient
in teaching the skills that the policy aspires to
inculcate. Converting the medium of instruction
to regional languages would take a long time to
put into practice. Some political factions even
consider it a futile attempt to impose the Hindi
language and hence, pose resistance. Moreover,
the multilingualism debate still persists as people
believe that there is no structured ecosystem to
accommodate regional languages all the way to
higher education and eventually, jobs as India
has 121 languages. Despite its shortcomings,
NEP 2020 was a significant step towards the
decolonisation of education as India is now
moving towards accommodating its diverse
needs. The government’s attempt to build flexible
learning pathways while providing an inclusive
education is truly remarkable.
The current system is an aggregate of all the
finest parts of each system or idea that preceded
Conclusion it. From incorporating regional languages in the
compulsory curriculum to skill enhancement
The future of the Indian education system holds courses, India has progressed substantially in the
immense potential. From being an oppressed field of education. India stands as a nation with a
colony to an independent nation, India has come rich history, a bright potential ahead, and a
a long way. Vasudhaiva Kutumbakan, translated present marked by conflicts between the two.
to “The World is One Family” represents our NEP 2020 is testimony to the fact that education
cultural approach towards global solidarity. will definitely fuel the growth of the country in
Keeping this as the motive for decolonising our the coming years, while keeping the people
education will bring us on par with the rest of the connected to their roots.
world.

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

ISSUE 1, VOL 1

DECISION
MAKING IN
FINANCE

featuring
AKSHAT SRIVASTAVA
Finance Influencer
 33

In Conversation with Mr Akshat Srivastava

Welcome to the fourth episode of our live interview series. Today, we are honoured to have Mr Akshat
Srivastava, a distinguished finance content creator and the Founder of Wisdom Hatch, a prominent
investment community in India. Renowned for his impactful contributions, Mr Srivastava has served as a
mentor to numerous students, guiding them to gain admission to esteemed institutions such as Harvard,
Columbia, MIT and others. Additionally, he holds a mentoring role at the UN Sustainable Development
Solutions Network – Youth, actively contributing to global goals in the areas of education, innovation and
social impact. Mr Srivastava's influential and thought-provoking videos on finance and investment have left
an enduring impact, aiding countless individuals in managing their personal finances and initiating their
investment journeys. His ability to simplify complex market concepts ensures that even beginners can readily
comprehend and engage with the content.

Arin: So coming to the first question. Sir, when it comes to investing in markets, how important is the
role of one's behaviour and risk appetite? Is investment based solely on data analysis and trends, or is it
also affected by what we commonly refer to as behavioural economics?

Mr Akshat: To answer this question, basically there is an academic way of investing in the markets and
then there is a practical way.

The academic way would say that you have to read 500 books. You have to do an insane amount of data
analysis, you have to build models and quantitative models for investing. For example, there is a big
event at SRCC. I assume there is a high frequency of trading firms which hire from campus, right? So this
is slightly more academic. That's one way of doing it. Another way is more qualitative. You learn from
experiences. You put in your own money, make mistakes, learn your investing style and risk appetite,
and then eventually you start making decisions. To directly answer your question, it's a combination of
different things. There are different types of investors in the market. For example, just to outline some of
the very famous investors. For example, Mr Warren Buffett is known as a value investor. He looks for
firms which are trading at a discount where the intrinsic value is low. And then he will go and buy that
stock. So this is quantitatively done. Some others are deep-value investors. For example, Mr Mohinish
Babra would buy Pitta. And then he will put in a lot of money and then it will grow. Some investors like
Mr Vijay Kedia are growth investors. He would not touch companies based on PE, ROCE, ROIC and
quantitative metrics. He will just simply go and pick small-cap companies. Extremely dangerous many
times. Illiquid stocks would not read very aggressively. Also, he will put money into those types of
companies. In 10 companies he's putting his money. He might lose money on six or seven. On the three
trades or three investments that he's making, they might give a lot of returns. Retail investors just follow
these major investors. Most of them might not have an investing style because one day they will follow
Mr Warren Buffett, another day they will follow Mr Munish Babra, and on the third day they will follow
this strategic area. So it's a mix of everything. That's the central message I would like to give. But I hope
through these relevant examples, you will see that there is a wide range of investing styles. There is no one
fixed investing style and everything under the sun impacts these stock returns or stock outcomes.

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

34

Ananya: That was insightful, Sir. Now moving on to the next question. Have you ever based your
investment decisions on ongoing social trends? If yes, then has that approach been beneficial to you?

Mr Akshat: If you mean macroeconomic trends, then yes, of course. Just to give you an example. So
whenever there is any shock in the economy, commodity prices typically fall. And there is a massive
shock. For example, when COVID happened or 2008, the assumption is that the World Trade is going to
slow down. The same thing panned out during 2020 COVID-19. People started assuming that the world
will start trading less and that's a panic event. So during such time, the commodity prices typically come
down and you could have seen it by looking at the oil prices etcetera. People who purchased commodity
stocks during that time made a lot of money. So I mean that's a macro trend, right? Second is that in a
growth market, people are willing to pay a premium on things. Premium means that, and you can assess
that by using the PE ratio, price to equity ratio. In our falling market, people might not be willing to pay
even 30P or 25P for a good company. But in a growing market for that same company, they might be
willing to pay a much higher price. So it's exactly like the supply-demand equation. For example, if you're
watching an IPL match in a stadium, you might be willing to buy a mineral water bottle at ₹100. But on
the street, if someone is trying to sell you that same mineral water bottle at 25, you will not buy it. It's a
market situation type of a thing and which type of market you are in. Of course, you have to assess all
these major points. So I'm not sure if social is the right word for it. But definitely, you need to look at the
market conditions and make decisions.

Arin: Alright, Sir. So moving on, do you agree that investment necessitates extensive research and
analysis for informed decision-making, and how will you as a seasoned investor address layman's ISM
regarding investing being an arena, right, with risks and losses?

Mr Akshat: So I worked in management consulting and one of the key things that or other two key rules
that we were taught was one was 80-20, right, which simply means Pareto principle. It says that 80% of
the results are achieved by doing 20% of the focused analysis. The second term, which is taught in
management consulting is: “Don't boil the ocean”. It means that you know there are one million things
that you can go and analyze. If you start analyzing everything before making a stock decision, you will
have to do a PhD on that. But that also does not mean that you go blind. I mean, whatever stock comes
to my mind today, I'll just go and buy it. So you can't do that either. So it has to be 80-20 in my opinion.
That's part A. Part B is that even if you spend 10,000 hours researching a stock, you will not know
everything about that stock. The bottom line is that there is only you as a normal retail investor or even
as a fund manager who can research a stock only up to a point. Therefore the principle of diversification,
which means that don't just for example, if you trust stock X, you don't invest all your money in that
stock. You can't do it. You need to have multiple assets and you can't take massive positions on just one
stock.

Ananya: Alright. Sir, the next question we want to ask you is will you say that your experience as an
investor has also shaped your overall behaviour as a consumer?

Mr Akshat: I invested and made money on ITC stock, but I don't smoke. I invest a lot in FMCG
companies, but I don't eat much-packaged food. So it's a yes and no type of question. I invest in Apple. I
own Apple products. When you get to learn about businesses and consumer trends, you become more
 35

active in the market. So you understand all those consumer trends. I mean as a general consumer, if you
never invest in stocks, then you have a philosophy of buying stuff. So your philosophy of buying
anything or consuming anything might be very different from your philosophy of investing. There is a
normal statement that is typically used that you should invest in companies whose products you
consume. I consume very little. So by that logic, I would not own anything. I'm a minimalist in terms of
my consumption, but when it comes to investing, I would be objective about where it would make sense
to invest. I'm not the only consumer who is shaping the market. There are 100 different types of people
who are there in the market. So I need to be appreciative of where the congruence of this overall
consumer trend is going.

Arin: Absolutely, Sir. Our behaviours do tend to influence us. So how does behavioural economics shed
light on the challenges of balancing short-term gains with long-term investment objectives?

Mr Akshat: Behavioural economics; the way I understand it from a market point of view is that it's more
about herd mentality. For example, right now the markets have reached an all-time high, and people are
getting more interested in the stock which means that they will invest more now. This might not be the
right viewpoint because when markets are heating up, and that is when you only tend to purchase, you
are getting everything at a premium. You'll not make returns unless you're buying low and selling high.
When will you get things low? When everyone else is panicking and you are not, and you are willing to
put money in the markets. So to cut the long story short, I think behavioural economics or that branch of
it is critical. It could be called the herd mentality or contrarianism. You have to be contrarian in terms of
picking the market bets because if you're just buying everything that other people are also buying, then
you will not make good money.

Ananya: So the next question is, are there specific behavioural traits or patterns that successful investors
often possess? And how can others learn from these traits?

Mr Akshat: See the first thing is that you must have a certain degree of contrarianism. If you do not take
contrarian bets, then you're not gonna make money. I can give you a lot of examples from my own
investment. The investments that I've made over the last one or two years are publicly available. For
example, I took a bet on Zomato. I took a bet on Meta when its stock was falling like anything. I took a
bet on U.S. stocks when the U.S. market was crumbling. I also took a lot of nifty positions at 17,000
Nifty. Now it is close to 21,000. So all these are contrarian bets for me. The number one thing is that
people should be okay with taking contrarian bets. It's critical because if you don't take contrarian bets,
you're not going to make money. Why is that? Because you might take a contrarian bet, then your
investments might come down. It might reflect a 20-30% loss and then people panic. They sell everything
and then never return to the market. And another important thing is to understand the type of investor
you are. For example, I drive very slowly and I cannot take speed. And that's who I am. However, in the
market, I'm slightly more of a risk-taker. So I'm okay taking a little bit more risk. Taking those
contrarian bets, and letting my portfolio fall by 15-20% is not a problem. So you need to understand
what level of risk you're okay with. I think these are some salient points.

Ananya: Alright, sir. Are there ethical considerations like sustainability that arise when applying
behavioural economics in the field of investing for companies?

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

36

Mr Akshat: For investors, no. I mean, if you are of that viewpoint, then the majority of the investors will
not be too concerned about the ESG part of investing. So the ESG part of investing is not something
that general investors would be concerned with. This is more applicable to the corporates. If they want
to make a corporate pitch that as a company they focus on ESG norms, and they are good for the
environment, then that is more of a consideration for them rather than the general investing community.

Ananya: And then we can take up the next question. Where do you see the future of behavioural
economics in the field of investing? Are there emerging trends or developments that you find particularly
interesting?

Mr Akshat: I personally don't think that the stock market is aligned as per economics per se. If that were
the case then economists would be the best investors in the world. But unfortunately or fortunately that
is not the case. Economics is the academic study of things or the academic study of collective human
behaviour. That's how we would put it. It is a part that impacts the market, but it does not lead the stock
market. The stock market is a bigger beast from that perspective. In terms of the trends, I think it has
always been the case. Behavioural economics has always impacted it in terms of risk behaviour, in terms
of the herd mentality that I was speaking about, and the ability to be contrarian. This has existed from
the time the first major crisis happened, sometime in the 1920s, which was the Great Depression. It still
holds true. People panicked in the Great Depression, people panicked when the 2008 crisis happened,
and people panicked in 2020. So behavioural economics continues to impact the market even now and it
is likely to continue to impact the investing behaviour even in the future.

Arin: Sir, I think the 2008 crisis that you mentioned, according to me, might have been stopped. So my
next question is how should the functioning of financial markets be improved to reduce the scale of
triggering financial and economic crises. For instance, many believe that the housing bubble of 2007-08
could have been avoided if the Fed had anticipated the market in time and taken corrective actions.

Mr Akshat: Yeah, I think it's a very natural process of the boom and bust cycle that happens. That
happens in terms of the business cycle also and it eventually reflects in the market cycle. So I don't think
much can be done in terms of preventing the boom and bust cycle. That will always continue to happen
because when times are good, people want to accelerate fast. It's like you're driving on a freeway. If the
freeway is clear, then you will drive very fast or you have an incentive to drive really fast. The only thing
that the governments could do is they could ensure more oversight and avoid building instruments which
lead to excessive greed. One of the key reasons why the 2008 crisis happened was something called
mortgage-backed securities. It was fostered by the subprime loans that were given in terms of housing.
I've done separate videos on that. You'll get a better understanding from my videos because what I might
be speaking now might look like Latin if you do not understand the crisis. So basically, the housing
market was booming. Banks were giving more and more loans to people who could not afford to have
paid the EMIs.
his was packaged at an instrument derivative level to the rest of the investing community. These
synthetic products should not have been built in the first place, but they were built because we were in a
good phase. The same thing is happening now as well. One could argue the consumer loans that are
being given out on a massive scale. Some amount of regulation can suppress the bubble but the bubble
will form. It's part of the greed and fear cycle which will go and that will lead to boom and burst.
 37

Arin: But if you talk about the collateralised debt obligations or the MBS that you talked about, lending
primarily was done to subprime borrowers which in itself was the consequence because the Fed reduced
the the repo rates of the respective country. So if the Fed had anticipated that in time, the lending would
have been stopped to the subprime borrowers maybe the recession could have been avoided.

Mr Akshat: The underlying assumption in the 2008 crisis was that the housing prices kept on going up.
These are mortgage-backed loans in a way. So when banks were giving out loans, the banks wanted to
give more loans. Second, a bank would not want to lose money while giving loans. They would not get
into a scheme where they feel that the people will be unable to pay them back. The banks assumed that
the housing prices would keep on going up. So they had some assets that they could foreclose and sell in
the event that people were unable to pay. The problem occurred when the housing market itself crashed.
The assets that banks were holding went down. The problem was not that people defaulted. That was a
part of the problem. That is what the trigger point was. The primary problem was that there was a
suppression of the asset class or the suppression of the value of the asset class, which was the house. And
I think that this type of bubble formation will keep on happening. Something similar is happening in the
credit bubble right now. If we consider the consumer loan bubble, more and more consumer loans are
being given. Everyone understands that you can't sustain this for a fairly long time. RBI recently came
out with the mandate of increasing the provisioning requirements from the bank’s side in terms of giving
consumer loans but have they just killed the consumer loan market? So the short answer is no. You can't
kill it. You can just reduce the size of the bubble from time to time. And that is what that is what some of
the countries tried to do in 2008. This is a very natural cycle. There will always be periods of euphoria
followed by crisis. And that is the reason why every one or two decades we see a major crisis.

Arin: So that was a great answer. So, do you think behavioural economics or behavioural finance in
particular should be taught as a subject in the curriculum of school students?

Mr Akshat: To be honest, I don't care too much about school curriculum. There are enough resources
that kids can learn from if they are driven. If parents are driven, they can teach them. So depending on
the school for learning, I don't believe in that argument anymore. I don't think schools can teach
everything. However, imparting practical knowledge and incorporating practical subjects into the
curriculum would really benefit the school structure. For example, people who genuinely invest their own
money, will be able to teach more. Expecting a teacher to know it is unreasonable. They teach for 6-8
hours, grade papers and take care of kids. They're not superhumans, right? From that perspective, they
can't do everything. So you need a good team. Unfortunately, the school curriculum is entirely dependent
on teachers. They are doing a great job but they need a better helping hand. So the curriculum should be
built in a way that there is more practical exposure for kids, be it in terms of business building, financial
literacy or other useful skills.
Practically, I think all the subjects are linked. For example, you can study a lot of behavioural economics
by studying history. So I don't think the separation of subjects is such a great idea to begin with.

Ananya: So coming to the next question, what is the driving force that keeps you following your passion
and love for finance and investment?

Mr Akshat: Since I put my own money, it's something that I would love to manage and keep track of.
The second is that when you are investing your own money, you become very practical in the sense that

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

38

you keep track of trends and you become more knowledgeable. On top of that, as I said on my YouTube
also, I love teaching because I want my kids to watch my videos eventually. My kids are very young; my
daughter is seven months old and my son is three and a half years old. So eventually when they grow up,
they will take an early interest because their dad is teaching. It might be fun for them to watch me on TV.
I think these are motivating factors for me to continue to make content. I only like long-form videos. So,
that's the thought process there.

Ananya: At a time when all major economies have kept their repo rates at a high level, can you bring to
light any recent examples where behavioural factors may have contributed to market movements?

Mr Akshat: Those two are separate issues. The repo rates have been high, which means that the interest
rate generally, and lending rates in the economy are high. That was initially done just to keep the
inflation in check because post 2020, a lot of quantitative easing took place. The government printed a
lot of money. There was a lot of movement of money through the economy, which typically leads to
inflation. Now to bring that inflation down, the interest rates were kept high. Has that led to the market
movement? In 2020, the markets went down. Quite aggressively. So just to talk some numbers, Nifty 50
was trading at 12,500. It came down all the way to 8000 during the 2020 COVID crash. Then it went all
the way to 15,000. Then there was a sudden jump. All this was done due to the quantitative easing cycle
and then inflation being pulled up. When the repo rates were increased, the entire 2021 to 2023 phase was
really bad for the markets. So all these are major movements in the market that happened. I would not
attribute it to behavioural economics, to be honest. These were macroeconomic movements. You could
have used behavioural economics to make money. So again, going back to that same principle of being
contrarian, when people are bearish, you become bullish. When people are bullish, you become bearish.
So if you'd done that, you would have made money.

Arin: This discussion was indeed insightful, sir. And as you have also put on your YouTube that “putting
the content that my son wants to watch”, I think I would surely watch all your videos. Thank you so
much for joining us. It was a great session.
 39

Behavioural Economics in Investing

Gunn Kalra

Researchers have been questioning the Rational

Introduction Actor Theory assumptions and have uncovered
evidence that rational behaviour is, in fact, not
Have you ever wondered why investors often
nearly as prevalent as we might be led to believe
make decisions that seem to defy logic and
by mainstream economics. Behavioural finance
conventional financial wisdom? What if I told
attempts to understand and explain how human
you that understanding the quirks of human
emotions influence financial and investment
behaviour could be the key to unlocking success
decision-making processes.
in the complex world of investing? Let’s talk in
figures. Humans often act irrationally – in
Concept and Rationale of
counterproductive, systematic patterns. 80% of
individual investors and 30% of institutional Behavioural Economics
investors are more inertial than logical.
Behavioural economics operates on the premise
Behavioural investing biases encompass both
that individuals don't always act rationally, and
cognitive and emotional biases.
understanding these deviations from traditional
economic models is crucial. The rationale behind
While cognitive biases stem from statistical,
this lies in acknowledging that investors often
information processing, or memory errors, an
deviate from purely logical decision-making due
emotional bias stems from impulse or intuition
to a myriad of cognitive and emotional factors. It
and results in action based on feelings instead of
considers the influence of psychological factors
facts. Behavioural economics studies real human
on economic decision-making, recognising that
behaviour in the real world to develop more
precise and practical economic models than those
provided by conventional economic theory.

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

40

individuals do not always maximise utility or chasing hot stocks, holding onto losing
profit as assumed by traditional economics. investments for too long or failing to diversify.
Real-world investment bubbles and crashes, like
The implications of behavioural economics for the dot-com bubble and the housing market
market movements and individual investor crash of 2008, were driven by behavioural biases,
outcomes are profound. Market movements are showcasing the tangible impact of these
not solely driven by rational assessments of psychological factors on financial markets.
information but are also significantly influenced
by investor sentiments, leading to market trends
Conventional Economics Vs
that may not align with fundamental economic
indicators. Understanding behavioural Behavioural Economics
economics helps in predicting and mitigating
market anomalies and sudden shifts, which can Daniel Kahneman's "Thinking, Fast and Slow"
aid investors in making more informed decisions. introduces two systems of thought - System 1
(fast thinking) and System 2 (slow thinking). The
implications for policymakers and businesses lie
in understanding how these systems interact.
System 1 operates swiftly, relying on intuition
and impressions, while System 2 involves
deliberate and effortful thinking. The challenge
for policymakers is to align these systems for
more effective decision-making.

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

Biases in Behavioural
Economics in Investing
Behavioural economics introduces a plethora of
biases that affect investment decisions.
Familiarity bias, confirmation bias, loss aversion,
the halo effect and experiential bias are
prominent examples. Familiarity bias leads
investors to prefer familiar assets, while
confirmation bias involves giving more weight to
information that supports existing beliefs. Loss
aversion makes investors fear losses more than
they value gains, leading to suboptimal decisions.
The halo effect involves an overall positive Behavioural economics challenges the
impression affecting specific judgments and assumptions of conventional economics by
experiential bias stems from past experiences introducing elements like availability heuristic,
influencing current choices. biases can lead to prospect theory, sunk cost fallacy and hyperbolic
specific types of investment mistakes, such as discounting.
 41

The availability heuristic, a cognitive shortcut,

reflects the tendency of individuals to rely on
readily available information while making
decisions, often leading to biased conclusions.
Prospect theory challenges the conventional
economic assumption of rational risk assessment,
highlighting that individuals evaluate potential
outcomes not in absolute terms but relative to a
reference point. The sunk cost fallacy highlights
the human inclination to persist with an
investment or decision solely because of past
investments, disregarding the current
Real World Investment Bubbles and
circumstances. Hormonal Influences
Examples of real-world investment bubbles, such
as the Tulip Mania in the 17th century and the
South Sea Bubble, demonstrate the historical
recurrence of irrational exuberance. John Coates'
research on the impact of hormones, particularly
cortisol and testosterone, on decision-making
during market fluctuations adds another layer to
understanding behavioural influences in finance.
This insight highlights the multidimensional
nature of behavioural economics.

Conclusion
Hyperbolic discounting challenges the traditional
exponential discounting model, recognising that In conclusion, understanding behavioural biases
individuals tend to place disproportionate weight in investing is paramount for success in the
on immediate rewards compared to future gains. financial realm. Investors need to be aware of
Free shipping deals are a perfect example of their own biases and take steps to mitigate their
hyperbolic discounting: "If you buy more than impact. The future of behavioural finance holds
£50, you get free shipping." If the buyer only has the potential to improve investment outcomes for
£35 in their cart, they're compelled to continue everyone by creating more robust models that
shopping to earn the deal. In essence, cognitive integrate human behaviour into economic
bias prefers the immediate reward (justifying a analyses. By embracing the complexities of
larger purchase with free shipping) over being decision-making influenced by emotions and
patient and waiting for a larger reward (having cognitive biases, investors can navigate the
more money in your bank account and making financial landscape with greater insight and
another purchase when the budget allows). These adaptability, ultimately increasing their chances
concepts provide a more nuanced understanding of long-term success.
of decision-making processes, acknowledging the
role of emotions and cognitive shortcuts in
shaping economic choices.

Nexus: Where Conversations Converge

 EDITORIAL BOARD

Arin Verma Paridhi Gupta

JUNIOR EDITORIAL BOARD 2023-24

Ananya Sharma Gunn Kalra

Kriti Agarwal Mishthi Dua Punya Kapur

THE ECONOMICS SOCIETY
SHRI RAM COLLEGE OF COMMERCE

www.ecosocsrcc.com
[email protected]