Jesse Friedman: Welcome to Impressive Hosting, where we uncover the core tenets of great WordPress hosting. I am your host, Jesse Friedman. Before we dive in, remember to check out impressivehost.com. It’s where you can comment on episodes, ask follow-up questions, and submit questions for upcoming guests. You’ll also find all our links to follow, like, and subscribe wherever you listen. With me today is Joshua Goode, WP Cloud Technical Solutions engineer for part two of what was a really awesome episode talking about WP Cloud. Yes, this is a very WP Cloud heavy episode. We’re normally interviewing folks from around the industry asking what it takes to run a hosting company, to market a hosting company, to attract agencies to help them grow their business, to align themselves with the success of their customers. But we wanted to have a conversation about WP Cloud because I’m always dropping little nuggets of information in these episodes talking about WP Cloud and who better than the person who seems to run everything behind the scenes for us on WP Cloud, Joshua, to come and talk to us. We were talking about the opportunities that we have as Automattic to set a higher standard for WordPress hosting and to say that this is what we want to see as far as the way in which WordPress should be handled and the experience that we want to give to end customers. And whether you choose WP Cloud or not, that’s totally fine, but we want to set a higher standard for hosting so that everyone across the ecosystem can have a really good WordPress experience. And then we talked a little bit too about sustainability in WordPress and making sure that it’s around for the next hundred years. You know, a common narrative throughout this podcast is that hosting companies have a responsibility back to the WordPress ecosystem. At times we’re talking about Five for the Future. We’re talking about making actual contributions. But the thing of it is, the thing that I want to drill home more than anything, and what I really want to hear from you, Josh, is what you think about this: I think a hosting company has a responsibility to that first WordPress experience, and that could be a DIYer who doesn’t want to become a web designer but has a project that they need to get a website live. And it’s just a means to an end. It could be a member of a board on a huge corporation who’s considering WordPress and maybe they’re moving from a SaaS platform or something else, and they’re unsure about open source and using WordPress, and I feel like the hosting company has a responsibility to making sure that that experience for those customers is good because it reflects on the entire WordPress ecosystem. What do you think about that?

Joshua Goode: Well, I totally agree. And something I’ve said in the past is that I obviously do hope that people use WP Cloud and come to a WP Cloud partner. But if anything, I really want us to set a standard and elevate the entire hosting community. So wherever you’re using WordPress, it’s a great experience and you stay in that ecosystem. As our WP Cloud partners, you know, one thing, given we’re offering all this out of the box, we’re offering all these great features, some people may say, well, what’s the catch? Am I really just limited? Am I in this box that you’ve created? And how am I going to differentiate myself and offer these world-class experiences? Maybe I can just go to another WP Cloud host or something like that, or worry that their customers may do that. We still offer extreme flexibility. You can create entire experiences focused. So if you want to focus on a niche, we have partners that do that. They’re in this niche hosting space and they understand that their specific targeted user group may not necessarily be your default kind of standard WordPress user. But they want to offer them a balance of a great WordPress experience and this highly customized solution that makes it so easy for them to jump, whether it’s in Patreon-like integration, and they’re really popular on Patreon, and now they want to expand to their own website and have that all tightly integrated. Press Board, one of our partners, offers such a niche integration there, and have it so easy to where they just click some buttons that the software’s pre-installed. All these kinds of scripts have fired into the background to get all their Patreon content migrated to the site and content locked and all of that, and it just happens. Well, that’s experience that you can create whether it’s that or if you want to, if you’re a realtor or if you’re hosting for realtors or anything across the space, if you don’t want to offer a vanilla WordPress experience, which for many, that’s ideal. That’s a goal. But if you want to offer something, that’s where a realtor or someone can come in and a realtor company can say, I want to create these specific sites and I don’t want them to go and install these plugins. But we have these plugin packages that can come pre-installed and automatically integrate to these other systems, and it’s just click, click, click, and we have a little AI integration there. Well, you can do that with WP Cloud. You can have your

Jesse Friedman: Yeah.

Joshua Goode: repository synced up to your default file system and have it locked down to where your user can’t go and modify, or it can’t get other code in there that you don’t want. Have that fully synced up. Have using our client SSH feature, you can have all these scripts. So if a button’s clicked in your panel over here, it automatically fires off and does a bunch of things on the site instantaneously. All of that can happen to where you can create these amazing experiences and really differentiate yourself from other WP Cloud partners, but any other host out there.

Jesse Friedman: Yeah, it’s very cool. We have a systems engineer on the team Demitrius, who likes to say that WP Cloud stays out of the business of your hosting. And what he means by that is that we’re very focused on the tools that help to power the platform. We’re focused on building up the boxes from bare metal on data centers that we operate, right? That we are managing. We focus on the security components and the technology. We focus on the performance aspects and fully integrated CDNs and caching and all that stuff. It just sounds like a commercial, but what we’re doing is we’re focused on all of those things so that the hosting company can decide how they want to go to market and what they want to do to solve for their problems. And so one of the things that you’re talking about is that we allow for the full management of plugins and the way in which WordPress is deployed on your account. So you can have it pre-configured to install certain plugins. You can have it even pre-configured to have specific settings, like if you wanted to offer, for example, e-commerce hosting, right? That’s a very common thing that we see these days. But maybe what you want to offer is something even more specific, like maybe you want to offer local mom and pop type, physical products sold within North America and shipped within North America type hosting, right? Where you are taking your physical goods and launching a WordPress e-commerce website instantaneously with all the configurations that you need. You could have WooCommerce already installed. You could have all the necessary shipping plugins and product plugins and everything else that you need pre-installed. You can even go as far as pre-configuring a lot of those things so that they’re using certain settings a certain way and doing things a certain way. You could even load it with fake content if you wanted to, and then replicate that as a clone of a site rather than deploying a vanilla WordPress. These are the tools that WP Cloud offers you that makes it available for you to customize it, bespoke it, solve a niche problem however you want to. And we’re just staying out of the way. All we’re going to do is focus on providing, making sure that the infrastructure is sound and secure.

Joshua Goode: That’s right.

Jesse Friedman: And it’s very cool that you bring that up.

Joshua Goode: And we, I’m personally, so in my role, I work directly with these partners from integration stage to they’re already up and running, and then they’re looking for solutions on how to solve a problem. That’s my technical solutions engineer role. And so

Jesse Friedman: Yeah.

Joshua Goode: it’s me just guiding them through. It’s not a fact that we have a limitation or guardrail that’s preventing them from doing that. It’s just guiding them through something that we already often offer. And something part

Jesse Friedman: Yeah, sure.

Joshua Goode: of our documentation just maybe we need to nudge them down the right path. And so with that in mind though, we do pay attention to feature requests and things like that. That’s something that we regularly see. And earlier we talked about PHP memory limits. You know, for almost all of our sites, I would say 99% of sites, what we have historically offered has been completely adequate. And if there was an issue, it’s often a bug or some poorly optimized function somewhere that could be fixed and addressed. We do have situations where maybe the agency involved in managing that site or someone, it’s not their prerogative to work on that or fix that immediately. And so the ultimate solution is they’re willing to upgrade, they’re willing to get more memory. And so working with some of our partners, that was just, you know, very clear. This is something that they would like to have, maybe not really ever use it, but maybe they will encounter a situation here or there where they can sell an upgrade to get an increased memory limit. And so that’s something that we are adding to the platform and maybe out by the time this episode comes out, or very soon after to empower hosts to do those things. So I do want to say we are opinionated and focused with our focus on WordPress. So we do things in very specific ways around caching and different parts of our infrastructure. But at the same time, it’s a very open and flexible solution. If you do hit a true roadblock situation, then you have me, you have my colleagues to talk to, and we can navigate to see what makes sense for you, for us, for your customers, and we can work towards a solution.

Jesse Friedman: Yeah. I love that. And you talked about the genesis of this new memory limit that we’re releasing that came about because we had a partner express to us that they’re running into issues and it’s an edge case, but they don’t want to lose these customers. And I think that one thing that’s really important to highlight here is that if you went with AWS or Google Cloud, I don’t mean to pick on them, but they’re big enough that they’re not going to feel me picking on them. You know, could you imagine going to them and being like, I need you to build a new feature. I’m one customer, I’m one partner, and I need to influence your roadmap and get you to change your settings and the way in which you configure things because I need that solution right now, the only way you’re going to change the course of that ship is if you are one of a million other people who have the same problem and need to solve those things. But we had a single partner who raised this as a concern and said that they’re running into an issue, that they have specific customers who have specific issues with certain plugins that are a little bit heavier in terms of memory requirements. Maybe they’re leaking a little bit. And yes, we want to move into helping those plugins to improve, and we want to seal those gaps, but at the same time, I need an immediate fix. I need something today to help try and solve for this problem with these customers. And so, you know, we had this conversation, it was actually in Slack, right? Because we have a direct line of communication with our partners. You were in that channel. Barry was in that channel. I was in that channel, and we were all just talking about the way in which we need to solve for this. And I think it was we had a beta version of it within hours to make it accessible to this partner so that they could start selling it right away. And now we’re going to be releasing it to the rest of the community, our community of partners. And I think it goes to speak to that this is the advantage that you get when you go with a platform like ours, because you can come in and actually tell us what it is that you need, and we’re going to work very hard to make sure that you are protected, you’re safe, your customers are secure. And I don’t mean just in the sense of having a secure website, but I mean secure in the sense that they’re not going to churn. They’re not going to leave because it is so important for us. You know, it’s funny because we talk about the way in which the community views a lot of things that are happening these days. I don’t want to get into the politics of all that stuff, but one thing I really do want to emphasize is that for Automattic, one of our core values has always been that there is power in the diversity of hosting, that the more of us that exist in distributing WordPress, the more we can learn from each other, challenge each other, improve each other’s odds at making sure these customers are successful. The better it is for the WordPress ecosystem. So when you become a WP Cloud partner, we’re not just invested in trying to make sure that your customers stay with you, we’re invested in trying to make sure that they stay with WordPress. So we have this two-pronged approach to making sure that these customers are happy with you and your solutions. So you kind of get that as a backing of Automattic when you become a partner of ours.

Joshua Goode: That’s right.

Jesse Friedman: Yeah, so really glad that we had an opportunity to talk about that, but I think we need to pivot real quick now because we’ve been doing this podcast now for the better part of six, seven months. I don’t know. By the time this episode comes out, it might even be eight or nine months. We’ll see how fast we’re moving. This podcast has evolved a lot in a short amount of time. We’ve gone from me being the kind of guy that’s been on other people’s podcasts to now I’m running a podcast, interviewing people. I think the actual episodes and everything else, we’ve matured. We’ve found our footing and we’re having a lot of fun having these conversations. But as much as it’s a lot of fun and I’m enjoying it and I’m having such great conversations, I do have a sabbatical coming up and the conversation came out of should I be running these episodes while I’m out? And as much as I love it, I was no, I want to enjoy my sabbatical. So if everybody’s thinking what is going on, what is the sabbatical? Automattic has this really amazing benefit. Every five years you get to take three months paid, essentially vacation, to unwind, unplug, and really just focus on yourself, come back with a renewed spirit and be excited to get back to work. And I have my second sabbatical coming up this summer. So the other option was maybe we do enough of a backlog, but I didn’t want these episodes to be coming out so long in advance. Josh, you are so ingrained in the WP Cloud part of things in the WordPress community. You know everybody as much as I do, so it made so much sense for us to say hey Josh, why don’t you come in and take over? And I’m really excited to say that you were hey, yeah, let’s do it. So we’re basically saying now that I’m passing the torch to you for the next few months, you’re going to be hosting this podcast in my absence. I know you’re going to make me very proud. I can’t wait. I think this is going to be the most connection I have while I’m out is just listening to episodes in Pocket Casts while I’m out. So tell me, what are you excited for in terms of being a host of this podcast? Are you hoping to accomplish any goals or surface any specific things that are top of mind for you? What do you want others at home to hear?

Joshua Goode: First thanks Jesse. I think this is going to be some big shoes to fill because I’ve really just been so appreciative and really enjoyed the direction you’ve taken with this podcast and the conversations you’ve been able to facilitate with people just about what, how we can elevate hosting and how different approaches people have taken. So I obviously want to continue some of that and I want to really dig in with people about what makes WordPress great, and then how do you take that hosting part, the very necessary piece of that, and how do we continue to push that to continue to grow WordPress and maintain that ecosystem. So I want to carry that on. I would like to talk with some partners about how they’ve experienced WP Cloud and the paths and decisions that they’ve taken to integrate with it. Because again, anyone can come in and they can keep it very vanilla or they can develop a very niche solution to hit a very specific target audience. So it’d be really cool to go into their thought processes and their ideas around why they took that path. And maybe we won’t reveal all the secret sauce of everything they’ve done, but maybe we can shed some light on the options and flexibility that we’ve empowered them to have to solve for a goal.

Jesse Friedman: Yeah. Very cool.

Joshua Goode: So there’ll be some really cool conversations to have. I do want to keep up with the style that you’ve got and we’ll bring some of my own style and flair to it. But I think it’s a really good template for me to carry on the torch. And again, very big shoes to fill there, but I think it’s going to be fun. And when you asked me to do it, it took me longer to finally get back to your message than for me to decide. It was almost an immediate yes.

Jesse Friedman: Yeah.

Joshua Goode: So here over time, my space we’re going to get some lighting adjustments. We want to get this camera adjusted a little bit too, for people that watch this, we want to make sure. I may not have the fancy background that Jesse has, but we’ll spruce it up a little bit. And for those listening, you’ll get to hear a lot more of me and a big focus of mine will, while I want people to be on WP Cloud, I am going to go in that focus of expanding our focus on WordPress and WordPress hosting. So I would love to get into hosting in general and not just how we’re doing things on WP Cloud all the time. So don’t worry, I’m not going to be making every left and right turn to sales pitch. I’m going to be very mindful of that. And I think, Jesse, you already do a great job of that.

Jesse Friedman: Thanks Josh. My only worry, though is that everybody’s going to hear how silky smooth your voice is and how it is made for radio and it’ll be very jarring when I come back.

Joshua Goode: Oh no, you have a great voice, Jesse. That’s how I catch most of the episodes is listening, so it’s been very enjoyable.

Jesse Friedman: Nice. Nice. All right, well let’s officially do it then. You are now the host of Impressive Hosting, so the torch is in your hand.

Joshua Goode: Yeah. Well, my first few minutes. Well, I guess that means I should ask you a question before we wrap up.

Jesse Friedman: I think so. I think that makes sense. Yeah, I like that. We’ll flip the script.

Joshua Goode: Let’s do it. Let’s do it. Okay. So I work with partners a lot on their integration and really getting all the technical things prepared for launching their product, and making sure all the little loose ends are tied up and stuff. Largely, again, from a technical perspective, and occasionally it may go into how they may talk about and approach things, but definitely not to the depth and detail that you do. But maybe, let’s say you’re talking to a new prospect and they’re just interested, or you’re already working with an established host and they’re about to launch. How do you, what do you do and how do you approach helping these hosts go to market? Really focusing in on the business side of how they’re going to take this thing that they’ve built and all the benefits that they have by being on WP Cloud and the strategies of how they can create plans and different structures of plans and stuff. I would just like to get into your inner workings and tap into some of the insights about go to market.

Jesse Friedman: Yeah, that’s awesome because this is going to become a little bit of a business 101 class here, a little bit of partnership wrangling. But so first things first is that a lot of times when I’m having an initial conversation with someone, it ends up being at an event. So CloudFest has been helpful with this. WordCamps have been very helpful with this because they come out of the woodwork, hosting companies to come to these events to support them, to meet and network and everything else. And so it allows for a very casual conversation to just unfold. And so the first thing I like to do is build trust. And the reason that it’s very important to build trust, especially with WP Cloud, is because let’s be 100% real. It is a WordPress-first cloud platform that is built by Automattic. And it is in a way servicing our own competitors, right? And so a lot of times these hosting companies are going to look at us and say, well, you’re also WordPress.com, you’re also Pressable. So how do we work together in a way that’s actually going to make sense there? So a lot of the work is really involved in just building trust between the two of us, because I want them to feel what I just talked about before, which is that we as Automattic see that there is power in the diversity of hosting. So if we can empower them to have a better experience, we’re empowering them to provide a lifelong loyal customer a much better WordPress experience. So what I’ll do first is really just get to know them. Get to know what it is that they’re trying to solve for. And it’s funny because if I walk in with my own assumptions, a lot of times I can just be flat out wrong. It’s funny because we talked to, there’s a really great case study on WP Cloud about Convesio and their go-to-market strategy, which was that they had this very fine-tuned own platform that they had that they felt the Convesio name became synonymous with, and so, but it comes with very hands-on white-glove enterprise-level support. And so they were missing out on the ability for agencies and others to bring on these hosting sites that maybe don’t necessarily have the budget for multi-thousand dollar hosting plans. And so they said, how can we actually move down market? And so that’s a completely unique way in which you can use WP Cloud. And just before you were talking about how WP Cloud has the ability to be flexible and solve the problems that you want to solve for, this was really unique because most of the time a hosting company comes in and uses WP Cloud to move up market to solve for enterprise-level solutions. So Convesio put us through our paces and they said that they identified that they would be able to use WP Cloud as a way that they can solve at-scale hosting, where they can bring these people on, know that they’re not going to need that white-glove service because WP Cloud’s going to handle a lot of it. They’re going to save a lot of money, which means that they can lower their costs for those customers and so they can round out those portfolios with those agencies while still servicing those high-end customers with that super aggressive level of support that they offer. And so in talking to Tom from Convesio, I was completely thrown. I was wow, that is not the conversation I was prepared to have, moving down market. Then you talk to other hosting companies and they want to do something completely different. They want to offer a niche solution or, you know, we have a partner who’s going to be going live later this year, who’s starting a new hosting company from scratch. They’ve brought in some really high-end players from around the industry to come together and do something there. So really, if you can build a rapport and you can build trust, you can create an open line of communication that allows for that partner to then share with you what it is that they’re struggling with, and then you can take that and craft a solution that’s going to help them. So when you mix a deep, intimate knowledge of the platform with a level of trust and a little bit of a sprinkle in there, some innovative out-of-the-box thinking, you can solve for most of their problems and just really help them to see how they can go to market that way. I’ll tell you though, it is hugely helpful to be able to pull you in every single time that I get cornered with a technical question that is beyond my expertise. So having you in my corner has helped out a lot there.

Joshua Goode: No, it’s always a pleasure. I always appreciate it when I work well with someone. I’d say we work very well together and we’re very lucky to have a lot of partners that work well with us as well.

Jesse Friedman: Yeah, for sure.

Joshua Goode: So as these conversations pop up at these conventions and stuff, what’s a typical question that a host may have to you? Whether they’re thinking about how can I take this and go to market or all of the above. How they even want to approach and get started with their business and growing their business, or starting a new business with WP Cloud.

Jesse Friedman: Yeah, so WP Cloud’s pretty cool because I’ve had to sell a lot of things in my life. Outside of Automattic, I can say that I’ve even had to sell things that I didn’t always believe in, which was not always good for me as a human being and worrying about my soul. But WP Cloud allows me to sleep at night because I know that I don’t even have to sell it. Basically, I just say to them like, hey, you can just try it out. We’ll give you an account and it’s a production account. There’s no such thing as a staging account. We have staging for your websites, but there is no such thing as like a WP Cloud staging account. So you’re gonna get the full power of it. You’re gonna get all the benefits of it. Just try it out and I’ll let you deal with that. It’s so great to be able to sell something that I can just hand it to you and let you play with it because you’re not gonna want to walk away from it.

Joshua Goode: Yeah.

Jesse Friedman: So the number one question then becomes, because I give them a heads up on how the platform works, all the things we’re doing, our core philosophies, by the time I get through how we have fully integrated security and fully integrated performance and we have automated real-time failover and auto-scaling and bursting and all these other things. And I talk them through it and I say. And now you’re gonna get to play with it. Let’s build a site, throw some traffic at it. Or if you even have one client, let’s throw them on there for a month. I won’t even charge you. Let’s throw some real traffic at it, and you’ll see how it works as the proof is in the pudding. So the only question they have left at that point is, how do you charge us? What’s the cost of it? That tends to be the number one question. And so the answer there is that WP Cloud is pay for what you use. There’s no upfront costs. We just tell people like, the investment that you would make in another cloud platform with some large contract or something like that. We just ask that you put that into doing the integration. Because WP Cloud lives at the API layer, there is a level of integration that you have to do. So you either have to build it into your own existing platform or you have to use PanelAlpha, which has done a partnership with WP Cloud to offer WP Cloud as a fully integrated system into their panel. We have our own homegrown platform, which is in beta called Station, which is really great for, I mean, I’m preaching to the choir, but I’m really talking to the people at home. Josh, you know, Station is this WordPress-powered platform UI that we built so that you can kind of reverse engineer and see how we would build a platform UI so that you can use the technology that exists there to integrate into your own platform or to even use Station if you want to, to kind of like make it more robust and grow it from there. So pricing tends to be the biggest question and the reality of the situation is for the most part, when you compare us to like AWS Google Cloud, we’re just saving you money. Which, you know, when we, based on who I’m having this conversation with, I go a couple different ways. Like with an executive, you want to have this conversation from the standpoint of increasing ARR LTV and making sure the customers are happy and loyal. If I’m talking to a sales team, I’m gonna tell them that they’re gonna have higher margins. They’re gonna be able to do a lot more to reduce the costs for agencies to bring them on board and migrate customers. If you’re talking to marketing teams, you’re much more focused on the fact that they can go to market and sell it at a price that makes more sense for them. They have a lot more flexibility in the way in which they’re selling. Craft different types of plans. Because everything with WP Cloud is not bolted on, fully integrated. The only real choices that you have in terms of configuration are like, how many workers you want, how many CPUs you want, how much storage you want, whether you want bursting on or off. So you don’t have to get into the, oh my gosh. I can’t even imagine if we had to sell WP Cloud where it’s like some customers get real-time failover and some don’t. Some get a CDN and some don’t. Oh my gosh. It would be painful. But because we have everything fully integrated, they just need to figure out how they want to craft their plans for selling. And I’m really hopeful that WP Cloud can kind of, as we talked about before, get out of the way of the business so that they can start to think about ways in which they want to change the way in which hosting is sold. You know, a lot of times what we see is we see a race to the bottom on pricing with shared hosting, with enterprise level customers, we typically see something along the lines of the first site is 20 bucks. The first 20 sites, the second two through 20 sites is like 150 bucks, whatever. And it goes on from there. And there’s always this weird complex thing of like, you’re using, you’re paying for more sites than you’re using. You’re paying for more resources than you’re using, things like that. I’m really thinking that WP Cloud could get to a place where we are providing this infrastructure in a way that allows for the hosting company to really kind of focus less on how the infrastructure’s run and things like that. Because we’ll take care of that and reposition their investment into like, how do we change the face of the way in which hosting is sold? Like, can we just make hosting maybe less visible?

Joshua Goode: Right.

Jesse Friedman: Maybe I sell a marketing plan or a SaaS product or something like that. And hosting just, it exists. It’s fast, it’s reliable, it’s up. You don’t even have to worry about it. We’ll just take care of the rest. You know, I would love to see hosting companies get into that business, maybe challenge Shopify and these other SaaS platforms a little bit more directly.

Joshua Goode: Beautiful. Beautiful. All right, well, I have tons I could unpack there. Jesse there, there’s a lot I would love to dig into. So maybe we will have to have a recap before or after your sabbatical, but I think as the new host here, I believe we’re reaching the end of today’s conversation. Is there anything that you…

Jesse Friedman: I like that John, the producer’s now hounding you to get off the call. Not me.

Joshua Goode: Right, right. But with that, you know, is there anything you want to close with?

Jesse Friedman: No. I’m just glad that the podcast is in good hands and anyone who’s listening at home, if you want to go to Impressive Host and ask to be a guest on Josh’s podcast. I think he’s gonna do a great job. I can’t wait to see what you come up with.

Joshua Goode: Great. Well, thanks Jesse. Thanks for having me. And then I guess well, thank you for joining me here at the very end. I really hope you have an awesome sabbatical. I’m looking forward to my next one, a little bit further away and I’m just excited to get started with this, to have some good conversations that you’ve already had here. And yeah, just really looking forward to getting started. So the next time that you hear me, hopefully, I look a little better. I’m not gonna replace Jesse in that sense of things, but I will bring my own flair there as the new host. So I do not know how you end this. You’ve already mentioned Impressive Host, Jesse, but is there anything else that you would like to plug? I’ll plug my stuff. You can find me at go.pro. That’s my personal website, but you can find more about the platform and our team at wp.cloud. You can learn all kinds of stuff about us and find ways to get in touch. And then Jesse, I mentioned Impressive Host. But outside of that, Jesse, anything else we should take notes on to close these things out?

Jesse Friedman: Yeah, I think normally we just say goodbye, but give the guest a chance. So I guess this is my opportunity to plug that. I actually have a website. You can go to jesse.blog. You can get me on Twitter at @professor. It’s not spelled weird or anything, it’s just professor. Yeah, I think that’s it. Now we can just say goodbye.

Joshua Goode: Perfect. Well, bye everyone. Thanks Jesse.

Jesse Friedman: See you, Josh.

Joshua Goode: Perfect. Well, bye everyone. Thanks.

Jesse Friedman: See you, Josh.

Joshua Goode: See ya.