notifier: stop queue filling due to single failed AM#14099
notifier: stop queue filling due to single failed AM#14099krajorama wants to merge 1 commit intoprometheus:mainfrom
Conversation
Ref: prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: György Krajcsovits <[email protected]>
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Nice work on the unit test. Principally I'd prefer 2nd, separate queues. This would allow completely independent processing and overflowing of queues. |
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an alternative 3rd solution with a shared queue I was considering was having a ring buffer, where there's a go routine for every alert manager that has a pointer into the ring buffer. Whenever the insert operation into the ring buffer catches up with an alert manager pointer, it would move that pointer forward, effectively dropping the oldest alert. |
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Thanks for this! (I always appreciate creative tests) In an ideal word, An SD is to be used for those AM instead of static config, so the faulty ones are excluded and the notifier doesn't have to worry about that. I'm afraid a "quarantine logic" would look like re-implementing the SD logic... |
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Hello from the bug-scrub! @krajorama do you think you will come back to this? |
Probably not :( Bigger project than what I have bandwidth for. |
Independant Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configurarion reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independant Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configurarion reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configurarion reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The buffered queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The buffered queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The buffered queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The buffered queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The buffered queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The buffered queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The buffered queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The buffered queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager queues avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The buffered queues are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]>
* notifier: unit test for dropping throughput on stuck AM Ref: prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: György Krajcsovits <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]> * chore(notifier): remove year from copyrights Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]> * feat(notifier): independent alertmanager sendloops Independent Alertmanager sendloops avoid issues with queue overflowing when one or more Alertmanager instances are unavailable which could result in lost alert notifications. The sendloops are managed per AlertmanagerSet which are dynamically added/removed with service discovery or configuration reload. The following metrics now include an extra dimention for alertmanager label: - prometheus_notifications_dropped_total - prometheus_notifications_queue_capacity - prometheus_notifications_queue_length This change also includes the test from prometheus#14099 Closes prometheus#7676 Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]> --------- Signed-off-by: György Krajcsovits <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: Siavash Safi <[email protected]> Signed-off-by: machine424 <[email protected]> Co-authored-by: György Krajcsovits <[email protected]>
WIP
Adds a unit test to emulate the problem of throughput dropping in #7676
Solution ideas (not implemented yet):
Fixes: #7676